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Clan city value and upkeep cost

Discussion in 'Design Discussions' started by kilrain, May 31, 2019.

  1. Scrapnotcrap

    Scrapnotcrap Eodrin
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    I like all of this. The communication is great. Big up to kilrain.

    I'm still pushing for clan points that we can accumulate through several tasks on top of the platin system.
     
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  2. JEDIMind

    JEDIMind Frostjarl
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    Kilrain I'm not sure if you saw my post awhile back about making starter cities the only cities.
    But it would fix a TON of problems.

    There's 6 starter cities.
    Let 5 be controlled and 1 as a legit starter city ( Make it Alfar )

    First I'll explain how this could help the faction situation.
    Let's say for example Dickheads own Sang. Dickheads are now a faction...we can set who's friendly and who is not. If someones not friendly is in our territory and we kill him of course we will not take a faction hit. But then we would be consider hostile to their faction ( and their faction would be decided on which starter city they own ) so going into their lands that player would be considered kos. Each player would have different standings for each different factions and if that player would want to increase faction with them it would be by paying taxes on farming mobs in their territory. You would have the option to pay taxes or say fuck them.

    Why would you want good factions with the enemy's? If there were only 5 cities these places would be hotspots of player masses...trading, dueling, crafting ( r60+ can craft in these cities ) billboards, and just a safe spot to chill. If you have good rep with you could be able to use their banks at all their outpost too.

    What would happen to other cities? Well these cities would be used to gain territory when TC hits...all these cities would just turn into outposts with banks only. But the point of having more territory would be to gain taxes from people farming, farming yourself, travel...more outposts...more portals to travel to. People will not be able to bind at outposts...just travel to them.

    The idea is to condense the pop but make it well worth it to own a city. Think about...only 6 places to bind? You would know where people are but at the same time caution about raiding it. Just look at the map man...like 4-5 clans own everything anyways...you could turn these cities into a real faction system that will be endlessly evolving and with real meaning...if you see a Defiance farming you may think twice about killing him cause that might be the only place you're currently able to use when it comes to trading, crafting, and billboards...if you mess up you can just go work it off for them and pay taxes.

    Starter cities able to be sisged once a month.
    outposts daily
    New clans would have to decide which faction they wish to join...or live out of CC, chaos stones, and o or the start city..
    Having only 5 factions would be like race wars without having race as a problem
    With the thread you got going now you could make Alfar lands noobie zone. Ideas like town criers and stuff that only able to be build in cities would also draw more value to these cities.
     
    #22 JEDIMind, Jun 13, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  3. kilrain

    kilrain Shadow Knight
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    Does the clan decide who they are friendly with? If that's the case then what sets this apart from standard clan conquest?
     
  4. JEDIMind

    JEDIMind Frostjarl
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    Players would have individual alignment vs factions.
    Ya we can war someone to siege..But let's say I have no problem with Blackwater...I would show as friendly or non hustle cause I've personally not killed any of them in their territory. So it comes down to a personal decision...kill someone friendly? Or keep it rolling? By killing me as friendly in their territory when I don't turn gray ( if I attack first ) would alignment hit them vs our faction. So now that player coming into our truff will be flagged as non friendly.

    Having only 5 main cities in the game will for sure make these valuable...everything should be able to be built in these cities..no point to have 10 cities with 5 mines between them..On top of that there would be 5 factions! And factions would be player maaaaaddddeee.

    war deck someone should allow for player vs each other not to take faction hits while war is playing out. Friendly blue...unfriendly red...war yellow..
    If you see someone yellow anywhere you can kill them with out any alignment hit.

    right now if I gank someone I turn red to all.
    this way I could kill someone from x clan but still be friendly with y clan.
    personal player made faction system.
     
    #24 JEDIMind, Jun 14, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
  5. kilrain

    kilrain Shadow Knight
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    Optional factions are the way to go for sure. I'm not 100% sold on the rules of engagement being up to the clan itself. That, to me at least, is what we have now and nothing really changes.

    Our original discussions internally went toward having 3+ factions that a player, or clan, could choose to join at any time but the rules of engagement were set in stone. You were always and only at war with the other factions. I've always had a hard time with it because clans could pick and choose who they join, there's nothing really preventing a zerg from happening at all because a player or clan could hop from the losing side to the winning side. Now, there never truly is a way to prevent that but I did start thinking that making the racial factions a thing could be the dividing point we really need. But optional, unlike originally.

    So this post of yours talking about using 5 capitals for factions and 1 for everyone to start it sparked an idea that I laid out a bit here.I chose Human lands over alfar just because it's more popular, not because I like it better lol. So what I was thinking is with that separation we make optional racial faction wars a thing. Everyone starts out in Sanguine, but can either individually or form all racial clans and join the faction wars. If you join the faction wars you are automatically set as enemy's to the opposing factions and cannot enter their cities (the other capitals), but you can kill opposing factions all you want.

    Another option that might be better is to create a number of factions that are not race specific and have faction standings. Everyone starts with 0 faction standing to all of them and if you join one faction you go negative to the other factions. If you decide to switch factions you have to first leave the one your in and farm back your faction points by farming in the faction lands you are trying to increase in. That would at least prevent hopping.
     
  6. JEDIMind

    JEDIMind Frostjarl
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    I wanna say first I only said Alfar cause people would fight over Human land city...sang is badass.
    Think about it tho...why are people gonna be instant red to another race or clan just cause of what they choose? People should be able to forge their own factions rep with out starting negative.
    I'm using capital racial cities cause this would cement the factions foundation.
    Give people the option..like I said before...if I have friends in other clans and I want to keep my standings good with them i can...and the way I said it you could not take faction hits if my clan ended up going to war with those people.
    Everyone and everything would just have a personal system they could control themselves.
    Don't like a clan? Go roam their territory....Maybe having a negative faction with someone would yield .05% more loot from mobs. So there could be a point targeting people you don't like.
    messed up and want to show that clan you want to be friendly? Farm their land for taxes and rep.

    Even then if player x was friend with clan y. If would come down to a personal decision to fight...so I kill this friendly guy and not be welcome in his land? Or welcome him to your territory to farm you taxes?

    Everything would come down to players on how your alignment would figure to other clans. Not a system that instantly says these people are my enemy.
    Also this could get rid of all these random lawless and lawful areas. There will be just his and her territory you know your in.

    Keep Cc for clans who refuse to join one of the 5 factions. Maybe call these rogue clans and let them expend their territory one square radius from the Cc. So these people could have things to do..if they were able to expend territory from the CC people who own land by the CC will eventually siege it.

    there's just to many holdings man...look how many our allegiance owns...it's a joke,pointless,pain in the was clearing groves and mines. 50 man clan spread between 20 holdings...condense this dude...putting everyone in one city where they can get to outpost ( old cities and hamlets ) they own would be perfect.



    Im bad at paint and I know I missed some cities, but I think you get the point. People would be able to forge their territory how they want. Get rid of these unless holdings and make people have a capital city to work out of. Turn all those yellow old cities to outpost where people can travel and bank at but NOT BIND. Only place you can bind would be your capital city. All the old cities on the islands would just become outpost people would fight over.

    Edit - If your only city is Sang and you own x2 outpost your Grove,stone quarry, mine, farms now product x2 of a normal resource
    There will still be sieges all the time over outpost if you leave the bindstone there for people to siege all the time. But no binding.
     
    #26 JEDIMind, Jun 15, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019
  7. Battle Smurf

    Battle Smurf Oak Lord
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    Anything that promotes people to make race specific clans and or have any kind of racial wars is a good thing

    Please try to find a way to to incorporate this with your blue/yellow/red zone ideas post

    Having the faction wars be race based but opt in= ideal way to naturally help prevent vet nutcups and one side from dominating so thoroughly

    I think there should be gameplay benefits/ rewards/ options for being a racially pure clan though

    When I say racially pure I'm fine with either 3 factions of alfar vs orks+ Mahirim vs Human+ Dwarf+ Mirdain

    OR every race is their own so 6. Whatever will keep things as balanced as possible, probably the 3 fac would be better though.
     
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  8. Fengor

    Fengor Obsidian Golem

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    It’s definitely a vast morale boost when you start a new game to see other players on the initial log in. Everyone starting in sanguine is 100% needed.

    I like the lawful/lawless sectioning, but it’s crucial to make sure when you transition from yellow to blue zone it’s not automatically safe. Like 30 seconds of being grey at least.
     
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  9. kilrain

    kilrain Shadow Knight
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    Agreed. How it is now, or should be if it's not broken, is it's 30 second unless you take damage which increases it up to 2 minutes, but can effectively be forever.
     
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  10. Oresmacker

    Oresmacker Obsidian Golem
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    @JEDIMind mentioned something about clan quest to do for upkeep. I really like the idea about city raiding. And if you could somehow make it to where the quest directed towards cities with most people from that clan that is bound to their main city or (capital) than the others would be awesome. And if it could only come avalible for the most active clans which is based on how many people are logged in would be nice. Also adding in some kind of reward for defending, and some kind of warning that you was being targeted. This could result in some very fun fight that’s actually have meaning to them.

    So if we have 25 people bound to marathain- you get more of a reward for defending than if we had 12. So people live out of one city mainly.

    It’s almost like a siege fight without all of the (imo) bad mechanics and waiting around that everyone hates about sieges.

    Another thing to make this work and for a lot of people to actually do it- would be to actually make the reward good enough for the upkeep to back the exspensive gear back people will risk.