Welcome to the Rise of Agon Community

Create an account today to engage in discussions and community events on the Rise of Agon forums.

Did this happen?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by betalpha, Jun 9, 2017.

  1. Biceps

    Biceps Infernal
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    565
    Likes Received:
    337
    lol @ ppl calling tokens a p2w feature. do you even comprehend what p2w is? look at planetside 2 if you want a classic p2w game. the tokens dont give you any advantage in a fight. sure you could sell tokens and buy more gear with it but cmon the tokens sell for literally nothing at the moment and a fp set is what? 20k ? add weapons, food, pots and regs to that and one token will barely give you one gear bag. if ppl are willing to pay 10 rl bucks for a gear bag then by all means go for it. just means more money for BPG so they can keep developing the game we all love.
     
    Rath TNT likes this.
  2. STDIO

    STDIO Gravelord
    Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    243
    Likes Received:
    267
    I agree there should be more gold sinks once everyone finishes scribing, but GTCs dont consume gold, they just transfer it from one player to another.
     
  3. TryHard

    TryHard Varangian Warthane
    Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2015
    Messages:
    887
    Likes Received:
    547
    I didn't read thread so sorry if this has been posted already: These GTT allow BPG the ability to combat gold selling, it makes it so gold sellers have to go really low price / people will just buy a GTT to sell in game, which brings money to BPG instead of some 3rd part gold seller.

    Edit: Even large games like EVE have a system like this in place.
     
    #23 TryHard, Jun 9, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2017
  4. RoD

    RoD Undead Dwarf
    Wealthy Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2015
    Messages:
    215
    Likes Received:
    244
    All that ppl says p2w plz go out with your dragon sets so i can kill you in my FP chest.
     
    Oresmacker, Fengor and Fawley like this.
  5. mybsurchin

    mybsurchin Celestial

    Joined:
    May 13, 2017
    Messages:
    630
    Likes Received:
    531
    When a gtc is used for a month subscription the gold value is deleted from the game

    It's funny how even when you agree with me you get it wrong
     
  6. STDIO

    STDIO Gravelord
    Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    243
    Likes Received:
    267
    'The gold value is deleted from the game' there is no net gain or loss of gold created by GTCs... Really don't get what point you are trying to make.

    GTCs are not a gold sink.
     
    Brown Dorf likes this.
  7. Anthrax

    Anthrax Goblin Warlord

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2016
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    86
    Its a terrible idea, both for the ROA economy as well as for BPG and their future financial success.

    They arnt selling anything that they wouldnt be getting anyway and are not making any additional money off of this. They are selling their future revenues and just being paid now. This means that months from now when these game tokens have already been sold to players there will be less revenue that they will be receiving because they have been paid for it already months ago, and likely already spent that money.

    Its Reganomics in ROA and will lead to financial issues for BPG down the road.
     
    Rorschach likes this.
  8. Bandido

    Bandido Skeleton Archer

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2017
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    60
    You make good points, With the uncertain end of times better to get the cash now.
     
    Rorschach likes this.
  9. mybsurchin

    mybsurchin Celestial

    Joined:
    May 13, 2017
    Messages:
    630
    Likes Received:
    531
    Talking with you is such a pain because you are just not very bright

    The value chain goes like this

    Gold -> gtc -> BPG

    Gold itself isn't deleted but the conceptual gold value of $10 is transferred to BPG

    As an example. If my raft is destroyed 2k gold isn't lost - an item worth 2k gold is lost
     
  10. STDIO

    STDIO Gravelord
    Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    243
    Likes Received:
    267
    Wtf are you talking about? Your initial post said that gold was deleted from the game with GTCs, thats just wrong.

    The effective transaction is player 1 buys a sub for player 2, and player 2 gives him gold for it. No gold is gained or lost overall, just transferred.

    The positive is that now player 2 can actually sub to the game, versus without GTCs he may not be able to buy a sub with cash. So that is +1 sub for BPG.

    You keep calling other people dumb but then you post something like this? I suggest waiting until you finish highschool before you tout some supreme understanding of how everything works, cause you still have a lot to learn.

    EDIT: Also no value is lost from the economy either, the $10 token is magically introduced whenever it's bought from the shop, and then destroyed as soon as it's consumed. This has no net impact on the economy.
     
  11. mybsurchin

    mybsurchin Celestial

    Joined:
    May 13, 2017
    Messages:
    630
    Likes Received:
    531
    Siiigh. I'm done. I even gave you a nice raft example and you still don't get it
     
  12. STDIO

    STDIO Gravelord
    Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    243
    Likes Received:
    267
    For the sake of being reasonable I'll just address your first post.

    So here's why GTCs have no net affect on the value of the economy: when you buy a GTC, the $10 token magically appears in the game and is added to the economy. When you use the GTC, that $10 token is magically destroyed and leaves the economy. No other material has entered or left the economy as a result of this process.

    Your post does include the second part, where the token is destroyed, but you forgot about the first part where it was magically introduced in the first place.

    The net effect is that the seller has 20k gold more and the buyer has 20k gold less. Thats it, no net effect on the economy as a whole.

    (Yes I am ignoring the value of GTCs currently in circulation as those only exist so that they can be destroyed, and provide no actual in-game value)

    I can attempt to explain further if you still don't get it.
     
    Kotic likes this.
  13. RootedOak

    RootedOak Oak Lord
    Legend

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2015
    Messages:
    3,036
    Likes Received:
    4,084
    Let me draw a picture for you. In 2011, Doc, the gold seller made over $100,000 on PA by calculating the prices in the comments of his review scores. Meaning only the review scores, and only the review scores with that items in the comments.

    His prices were so outrageous that you couldn't go without buying from him. 800 portal shards for $0.08 each? Why even PvE ever?

    When an MMO dev takes it into their own hands, it forces players out to collect items which fixes the economy, and allows that very healthy salary-sized chunk of money go into dev pockets.

    That's just ONE item seller from PA. Just ONE. Maybe AV wouldn't have gone under had they sold subscription tokens.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    kilrath81 likes this.
  14. mybsurchin

    mybsurchin Celestial

    Joined:
    May 13, 2017
    Messages:
    630
    Likes Received:
    531
    Sorry bud its you who really don't get it

    I guess you think if an armor set is destroyed by durability loss that nothing has exited the economy because it was crafted from material that magically appeared in game?

    I guess when a fleet of ships is destroyed in eve that no value exited the economy because the ships were crafted with material that magically appeared in game?

    Let me know if I need to come up with more examples.
     
  15. Check Mate

    Check Mate Stormgraive

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    Messages:
    358
    Likes Received:
    442
    Let's be real we all know Doc was Tasos xD
     
  16. AdamWest

    AdamWest Goblin Warrior

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Messages:
    39
    Likes Received:
    20
    The issue that is overlooked in these discussions is that it normalizes buying gold.

    There are players who are not comfortable buying gold from third party sites. Now that there is an in-game mechanic for this, where there is no risk of transaction fraud, no risk of being banned for RMT, and they know their money is helping to support the company, more people will be spending real money to skill up their characters (and not just in crafting skills, now that we have scrolls), gear them out, keep meditation points filled, buy cities... If that's not making this game more pay-to-win, what is?

    I'm not saying the former situation is preferable in all aspects, as providing an avenue for free play hopefully boosts population. It's just that it's another change that is killing my desire to login as a casual player.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    PENETRATOR likes this.
  17. RootedOak

    RootedOak Oak Lord
    Legend

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2015
    Messages:
    3,036
    Likes Received:
    4,084
    I hope it was one of those disgruntled employees who wasn't paid for 11 months.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    onslaught likes this.
  18. Killa162

    Killa162 Crypt Guard

    Joined:
    May 3, 2017
    Messages:
    197
    Likes Received:
    115
    Man your logic must be brilliant then...
    Common sense logic in this case since you don't have any when multiple people tell you why this is a good thing is:
    1. BPG gets paid instead of gold sellers. More money in their pockets the better then can use the money to hire staff, fix issues, or spend that money on any assets they need.
    2. This in the next week or 2 weeks not only competes but most likely will drive gold sellers away completely if they won't to stay in business. Meaning they have to devalue their gold compared to BPG.
    3. When you buy a Token the player trading the gold physically gets something that benefits them for their time spent. They get a month of game time for their farming they have done. That's $10 less they have to put towards sub costs. And basically even with them using the token the person that bought the token to begin with essentially "bought" the sub ahead of time, so BPG isn't losing out on sub money. GTT are just a cash advance.
    4. Lastly with people leveling magic or buying gearbags as a destro, that stuff is expensive in the current market. It's not rocket science where to get and farm gold, so what if u want to farm and trade for GTT then that's great. If you spend $$$ for GTT to get gold without the farm, who cares? Someone had to do the farm to obtain the gold for the trade. So what difference does it make.
    P2W is when you directly buy an item that gives instant power over another that has no other means of being obtained other then through the cash shop. Instead of grinding for the gold, they buy a token and someone else did the grind for them. It's a mutual exchange and it's just like PLEX from EvE Online. Or better yet, WoW Tokens that are an exact copy that only sell through the AH for gold. The gold you obtain isn't used for some weapon or armor no1 else can't already get from crafters.

    Tl;dr Stop your bitching, this is good for RoA, BPG, and all of us that want to benefit from it. Farm 20k gold in a few hours or 1 hour depending on the farm location, boom you got 1 month for free, and all you did was play the game.
    Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  19. STDIO

    STDIO Gravelord
    Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    243
    Likes Received:
    267
    Maybe you should re-read your first post.

    What you said was that the introduction of GTCs provided a new way for material/value/whatever to leave the games economy. It didn't, because in order to destroy the GTCs and get rid if that value it has to be magically introduced in the first place.

    So I guess if you want to nitpick then yes they did provide a new way to decrease the value of the economy (consuming GTC), but they also provided a new way to increase its value (buying GTC), and those things happen at a fixed 1:1 ratio. So the net effect is zero.

    Please just read this last paragraph because I think that's what you're confused about.
     
  20. Ulfang Blackmane

    Ulfang Blackmane Skeleton Archer
    Hero

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    118
    Likes Received:
    113
    The problem with your argument and example is that the gear and ships don't just magically appear in the game. People grinded for them in game, there was time and effort put into their acquisition by playing the game. With the GTT people just buy them straight up with RL cash, there hasn't been any input into the game itself to create the item, thus STDIO is right to say they "magically appear" in the game. He's also correct in saying that nothing has been taken out of the economy as money and goods in the game aren't destroyed somehow when these items are generated, traded or used. Quite simply, the only item added is the GTT, and this is then removed upon use.
     
    Dixie Normus likes this.