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Discussion: Early Development Roadmap

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Hugo, Mar 3, 2016.

  1. Wizard of Yndor

    Wizard of Yndor Deadeye

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    GOOD! A sandbox game community doesn't need nor want your computer auto-harvested mats flooding our markets. That is the job live players are supposed to be doing.

    That is exactly what a sandbox game community needs. Less bots (call your afk harvesting what you want, but "bot" works for me) and more live players.

    Now when you log into the game, instead of having your own personal supply of materials (that you didn't even earn) you will have to seek out some other player to obtain those mats.
    You will have to actually interact with the game community. Instead of being the supplier of harvested goods, you become the buyer, a consumer supporting another live players play style. That is exactly how a sandbox community is supposed to function. AFK harvesters break the sandbox at its foundation.

    Fortunately, the RoA team seems to understand some of the fundamentals of what makes a sandbox community tick much better than AV ever did. Lets hope they can follow through with making it work.
     
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  2. PENETRATOR

    PENETRATOR Earth Elemental
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    Couldn't have said better myself
     
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  3. Carrot Soup

    Carrot Soup Celestial
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    again, i'm not a bot, and i dont own a bot or even an alt to make into a bot. get over yourself please.
     
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  4. Nuyur

    Nuyur Wildtribe Mage

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    Well, i think bot isnt the word he wants to use. Or isnt the word he should use.

    He means...non interactive player.
    A player who's in the game...might even be doing something...but there's nobody at the keyboard. No response to anything.
    The potential pinata you feel to be, isnt something he wants to smash.
    He feels its better to not have semi-afk tasks in the game, because it leads to very bland player interactions.

    I understand your motivation Yndor, but can you at least admit that other games like EvE do have a large portion of their playerbase as just semi-afk players. People who start up a harvest, walk away. Come back 10-15 minutes later, start another.
    They obviously arent a very active part of the community. Id imagine most of them dont even USE the wealth they build up.
    But if your biggest motivation for not wanting this is the potential economical advantages players gain. You do realise its very little.
    And if players are willing to use multiple accounts to do so, wouldnt that also provide a postive for BGP...

    This may be a principle ofcourse. Something that goes against what you (and/or BGP) dont want to allow.
    But with the item added in for sub time. Wouldnt you just "straight up" buy gold for money?
    I fail to see how multiple accounts harvesting is any different from trading a bought item with money for gold.
    Id almost argue the account route takes actual commitment from a player, while the alternative is a fairly straight forward transaction.

    And to some extent, i'd almost prefer the harvesters...because its another body out in the world. Even if its not very thrilling to kill one.
     
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  5. Flying Dutchmaster

    Flying Dutchmaster Gravelord
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    First decent post for the AFK support side, grats

    Still I support BPGs vision.
     
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  6. Nuyur

    Nuyur Wildtribe Mage

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    Im not picking sides...
    I personally didnt harvest, because it was boring as fuck and literally required no player input aside from moving every 10~ minutes.
    Not to mention it provided very little...

    I dont semi-afk games, it just seems wrong to "play" a game by making your character harvest (or something) and going off to fold laundry in the mean time. When i play, i want to be actually doing stuff.

    But that doesnt mean that there arent many people who enjoy the semi-afk stuff, because they may have a lot of laundry to fold...
    To exclude an entire demographic (if you can call it that), just because you dont feel like it adds to the livelyness of the server seems to be going a little far to me.

    So im trying to figure out what it is that is viewed as negative...because i really dont mind if there's hundreds (or thousands) of players that want to semi-afk harvest nodes in their spare time. They arent a threat to me, they provide to me directly when i kill them, they provide indirectly by making more materials available to the market. Worst case scenario, the gold value increases as iron/wood ect becomes abundantly available.
    I dont see a negative, not for the game or myself.
     
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  7. Kozzion

    Kozzion Goblin Warlord
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    If nodes consist of lets say 10 resources per node there wont be any AFK gathering as people will have no time to go afk and be more actively running from node to node.
    The respawn timer shouldnt be 1 hour though if the resources/node are very low.

    Empty nodes could be still gather resources if a certain high value gathering tool is used. This is to compensate the "fuck everything is already dried" feeling that will mostly occur when there are quite a few people around NPC cities.

    The reason AFK gathering existed is because it took like 10-15 min for a full node to be gathered and you could do it close to the city wich was relatively safe.

    Less resources close to the city, more gathering in the world and/or remote spots become useful. the world is large and full of resources. If the system can sustain itself where players can harvest everything they need close by there is something wrong with the system.
     
  8. Inkarnation

    Inkarnation Frostjarl
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    good point
     
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  9. Action_Jackson

    Action_Jackson Deadeye
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    I liked semi afk harvesting. You'd only get around 40 iron ores from a node so you didnt really harvest afk. But you could do some rl stuff, surf,play with your child or argue with your wife or whatever and yet still progress ingame.
    If you wanna play active you certainly dont want to harvest stuff, so this was quite good already.

    And as said 40 ores are not much from a node. Why do you plan on lowering that amount.
    Well im certainly open for new ideas but this....

    And i see people tossing ideas around here. Only 10 ores per node and faster refill or nodes are not so close to cities anymore... well all of this has pros and cons.
    Youd still run the same route every time and will still be boring even if its just 5 sec per hit and only 10 ores per node.
    And AV did a good job with iron node distribtion already.

    What I do like are the visuals on empty nodes and the rare nodes.
    Was is so that you had a slight chance for rares in normals nodes in df2012? Dont remember really.If yes keep it.
    --- Post updated ---
    I like your roadmap. Seems realistic.

    What I dont like is the portal idea and the harvesting stuff as mentioned in my post above.
    Im dont think the portal system in df was good but open portals in the wilderness so everyone can travel very fast where he wants is pure dog shit.
    Maybe its not explained so well and i didnt read 16 pages, only 3, but roads are meant for traveling and if you wanna go faster go farm runestones.
     
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    #309 Action_Jackson, Mar 31, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2016
  10. mcdoogs

    mcdoogs Chosen of Khamset

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    Neither the old nor the new harvesting systems seem like 'fun' to me. Isn't that what games are for? Seems like too much effort to 'combat' harvesting alts to me (as others said, it does nothing to combat true bots). It all seems like an unnecessary step sideways to me.
     
  11. MtH-HrT

    MtH-HrT Goblin Warrior

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    I like the first part when you say:
    So, in this perspective, I like the opportunity to inspect the corpse of an incapacitated player, and I also like the thing that buffing or healing a red/grey will make the caster grey causing temporary rogue status.
    You should also remove offensive spell skill-ups from mounts.

    But I think that before the opening of the closed beta (considering that a payment will be required, and people will associate this with a kind of first release) you absolutely must find a way to regulate the declaration of war between guilds.
    It's hoped not to see again hordes of barbarians who declare war on guilds of new players, torturing and killing them constantly and without penalty to the crafting stations inside every starter city.

    What do you have in mind to prevent this unfair practice which instantly killed the interest of many players during the first few months of 2009?

    ps: just to be clear, I'm not asking safe zone....
    A possible solution could be a very high cost of declaration of war, and the state should be limited in time. A guild declares war, within a specified time should activate the siege (if the siege stones are not placed the declaration of war ends), and once the siege ended also ends the declaration of war.
    It might work?
     
    #311 MtH-HrT, Mar 31, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2016
  12. Synna

    Synna Black Knight
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    take a look at eve, its a mostly afk system that works great
     
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  13. Hawkeye Helrazor

    Hawkeye Helrazor Skeleton Archer

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    In a similar way though if you look at Rust, it has a faster paced resource gathering system like ROA is suggesting and it works just fine!
     
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  14. Synna

    Synna Black Knight
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    exactly, roa is suggesting to make it like rust
     
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  15. Hawkeye Helrazor

    Hawkeye Helrazor Skeleton Archer

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    Need to find a healthy middle ground :sunglasses: or somehow adopt both play styles??
     
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  16. Synna

    Synna Black Knight
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    thats eves
     
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  17. Kozzion

    Kozzion Goblin Warlord
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    well to be honest about the "new player experience" ... if you be realistic ... how many new players that don't know about DFO would you even get ? Don't ge me wrong, it would be nice to have a ton of new players in the game but hows that even gonna be possible? This game can't be launched on steam no ? Advertising will be peanuts as there is no budget for it ?
    And don't forget the eye candy, we are talking graphics here from a game that existed 8 years ago. That factor alone will keep a lot of players out of the loop.
    It would be a victory if you can get the playerbase from DFO back at launch, but you don't have email adresses to send advertisement mails to.
    I just don't want to see this "new player experience" take a lof of effort, time and work and compromises of the dev crew simply as I think there won't be any real new playerbase
     
  18. Nuyur

    Nuyur Wildtribe Mage

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    great mindset for success there kozzion.
    With that mentality they might aswell not try
     
  19. Kozzion

    Kozzion Goblin Warlord
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    Like i said "dont get me wrong, i want a ton of new players" I just raise the question on how on earth we would even get new players. Do you have the answer? Or can you relate and see the question i raise here?
     
  20. Nuyur

    Nuyur Wildtribe Mage

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    Im not really worried about finding new people to try the game...
    I am worried that they wont like it, and leave.

    There's games out there that are 10+ years old (eve, tibia, uo) that still have 1000's of people playing.
    Now ofcourse there are some that have been playing since it came out...but if no new people ever joined, the games would only lose population.
    Not saying DF is like any of those, but people try out new games...especially if the game is doing well and has good reviews ect