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Discussion: Project Update - Dec 14th, 2017

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by MWTaylor, Dec 15, 2017.

  1. MWTaylor

    MWTaylor Community Manager
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    Today's project update discusses the next patch, introduces a new developer and outlines the next sequence of patches to expect.

    Read more: Project Update - Dec. 14th, 2017
     
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    #1 MWTaylor, Dec 15, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2017
  2. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Fire Elemental
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    Awesome stuff! I have a question though. It sounds like you plan to implement distance based fees on the market, for example, a player in Ymir's Tear will have no distance fee on local goods but has to pay extra to purchase something from Flaming Skull. Wouldn't it always be optimal to simply teleport to Flaming Skull if the fee is larger than 2000 golds? Also, don't you think that Sanguine being the permanent trade hub of Agon is very problematic? Currently it is the only capital city that is used extensively and the only players that live in Flaming Skull and Red Moon tend to be Ork pvpers and Mahirims who are mostly new to the game. I fear that this market change will exacerbate the problem, I hope you will reconsider before it is too late, distance based fees do not make sense in a game with teleportation.
     
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  3. Wes Furtive

    Wes Furtive Obsidian Golem
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    +1
     
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  4. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
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    The delivery fees are meant to be minor and for convenience only, also not everyone will have runes set up to every area or may even want to bother if the fee is only 2500g and they don't have to go to the location, get the items and then go back to their old location. It's there as a convenience and you can either pay it(It will scale by percentage likely), teleport to the location through various means or simply travel to the location yourself, have a guildmate buy it, etc, etc.

    The idea is that delivery fees will actually help with multiple market areas because traders can put items on in multiple areas and for example in areas where there are fewer people selling you could put your wares up for more because it will be cheaper than a delivery/teleport fee. This of course is simply variables and likely something we'll tweak here and there to ensure it's working as intended or if it needs to be changed, removed, etc.
     
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  5. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Fire Elemental
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    Sorry to bring this up but UW had that and everyone hated it, all markets were dead except Sanguine, all racial lands were dead except Human lands. It sounds like this system punishes new/poor players and slows down play for everyone, causing needless loading screens. I get what you're trying to do and maybe you can figure out a way to make it work, but I did a lot of marketplace trading in UW and in my experience this is not going to end well. One of my big hopes for the game is that all racial lands will be used.
     
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  6. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
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    Capital recalls will help spread people to their own areas better and we are planning to look into race balance to ensure there's a healthy balance of characters. Some other ideas include increased sales tax based on marketplace activity to encourage other less used markets to get used due to a premium for selling on the busier markets. This is an idea that is just beginning and just going into the game, it will evolve and our ultimate goal with capital cities is to make them all hubs for players to gather around for various reasons and as the new starting point for all new players to a race. We want them to be active areas where people meet and see an active world immediately, to ensure that happens we need to give more reasons for players to want to be in the cities and will be a focus for non-combat activities so we can turn them into big social hubs. We don't want just one capital city to become the ONLY social hub because it will be way too busy heh... 6 however would do nicely and give some variety due to the different architecture and lore, among other things.
     
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  7. kilrain

    kilrain Oak Lord
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    I'll chime in with, there is nothing wrong with having a market hub. I've never played a game that didn't have one and I've always played the market in every one of them. With that said, having a charge based on distance will allow players who previously spread goods around to reach more customers something to look forward to. People, all people so no disrespect to anyone, are inherently lazy and will always take the easiest way even if it's not the most cost effective. Just look at real life and how many conveniences you pay extra money for.

    The best way to get people to hang out in the different areas and populate all of them is to provide multiple reasons to be there. If a decent number of people are hanging out in Shoal, for whatever reason, someone who plays the market will place or transport goods from Sanguine or wherever and make a profit while still providing a better deal for the people hanging out there. That's just part of it.

    In short, there's nothing wrong with a trade hub. Give other reasons than just the market to use the different racial areas. The associated costs can be of value for those that wish to play the market. Also, most people wont want to travel to Sanguine all the time, especially at 2k round trip cost, just for basic trades.
     
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  8. aparks

    aparks Black Knight
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    I think your market should be a World Trade Center in the middle of Agon that you have to run to or mark runes to
     
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  9. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Fire Elemental
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    I see, that's an interesting set of points. First of all, I can say that I have seen barely anyone in Alfar and Dwarf lands (heat map backs that up usually), this is mainly because these races have a crafting racial and thus tend to be crafting alts, lacking parity in combat racials makes most people not want to play them, alfar magic resistance does nothing against destroyers and the TTK is VERY high, making dwarven perserverence less attractive although it is very good. Trying to encourage trade in each racial land is a neat idea, I am very curious if that will work!

    The issue with a market hub in RoA is that it makes all non-humans have to constantly spend 2000 gold just to do a trade, it's very expensive. Because capital recall exists and some races are better than others it feels like trading is not very fair at the moment. I think if your plan is to make each racial capital into a hub for activity and trade you should really try to diversify the races more and make them more interesting, right now they match up so clearly with certain builds and there is no room for creativity, it is too obvious and simple to pick the optimal race for your build. It would be interesting to keep the traditional feel of races in RoA but make them unique by adding unconventional bonuses as well, make them stand out from other games, the hardy dwarf and brutal Ork are great but it is very basic as well. As you add bonuses to races, please consider making them pop more. Here are some examples:

    • Mirdain gain a bonus pertaining to ships
    • Orks gain a bonus pertaining to religion
    • Alfar gain a bonus pertaining to negotiation
    • Dwarfs gain a bonus pertaining to archery
    • Mahirim gain a bonus pertaining to the sky
    • Humans gain a bonus pertaining to history
    As always, these are just examples to outline an idea. As you can see, these concepts move away from old tropes and help to make RoA's spin on classic races more fresh, a Dwarf archer is interesting as they are usually associated with heavy armor and weapons, mining, etc, while Alfar being skilled negotiators moves away from their more obvious evil nature, this makes them pop.

    Ideally I think races should be designed in such a way that changing your race is always a fun consideration, the more depth they have, the more fun they will be to pick and tinkering with builds is a great way to keep players interested. Right now the races are alright but they are too linear and traditional, they don't have any uniqueness and feel the same as they do in any other game, please consider making them pop with unconventional bonuses or even drawbacks. The more diverse and thought provoking races are the better chance your plan of making trade flourish globally will be imho.
     
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  10. kilrain

    kilrain Oak Lord
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    True, but also a pre-market observation. Once the markets are in place it's a completely different story. The cost to purchase an item across Agon would be more affordable than a round trip with a rune book.
     
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  11. Korag

    Korag Fire Giant
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    But it doesn't work that way, I mean I don't know if you played Unholy wars but this is exactly how AV did it and every city besides sanguine was dead like perma dead and your making the same mistake like following directly in their footsteps on this one, I really don't get it, yall should of at least done some research prior to making this decision
    --- Post updated ---
    when it comes to money people are less lazy especially expensive or constantly used items, you are looking at this backwards and with the wrong colored glasses on. How can I say "this has been done and failed before" to you any differently so that you can understand it?
    Market hubs are a good thing but this system does not create them, as we CLEARLY seen in UW when AV used this exact same model for a marketplace. Trust me when I say just because you didn't mind blowing a few k extra gold every time you did a purchase that not everyone and I mean a large majority feel differently, you are in the extreme minority if you think people will happily pay the extra several k because they are "lazy" specially with rune books now making it easy to travel to one location. I mean before rune books people of every race traded by using a rune stone in sang that isn't going to change and will only increase with this market system
    --- Post updated ---
    wouldn't be a round trip, as you only have to use the rune book to get to sang, then normal or house recall to get back. So more than likely it will almost always be cheaper depending on the items being bought(cost) etc.
     
  12. kilrain

    kilrain Oak Lord
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    It will always be cheaper or take less time, time == money. You'll just have to experience it when it does come around to see what I mean.
     
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  13. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
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    We're fully aware of the potential pitfalls and will make adjustments to get the intended results we want of activity in all capital cities. As Kilrain mentioned as well just because markets make some areas more popular doesn't mean there's not other things added that will cause activity in some of the lesser used rates.
    --- Post updated ---
    Test server is currently offline, it will be brought back online in the morning. Sorry for the delay guys!
     
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  14. Korag

    Korag Fire Giant
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    wouldn't be a round trip, as you only have to use the rune book to get to sang, then normal or house recall to get back. So more than likely it will almost always be cheaper depending on th
    Did ya not read my post? I have experienced it in UW the exact same system av did, that yall doing now.
     
  15. Frog

    Frog Black Knight
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    i know there's a better pic you could have used for kilrath
     
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  16. Neilk

    Neilk Web Development & System Admin
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    PTS is online now
     
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  17. Kilrath

    Kilrath Goblin Shaman
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    It's the one I gave them, they didn't have another one to use.
     
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  18. Frog

    Frog Black Knight
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    what about this one?

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. Skelly

    Skelly Deadeye

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    I think the number of capital cities should b lowered
     
  20. Supafro

    Supafro Undead Dwarf
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    Quality update.
     
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