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Equipment reward tier is not practicable

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Shivs, Dec 2, 2017.

  1. Shivs

    Shivs Crypt Guard

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    If you care about your encumbrance, and most do, then the requirements do not work with the how most play the game.

    For example, Tier 4, you need 4 FP parts and r60 weapon.

    To be fair the encumbrance is around six, I prefer to wear leather boots to stay near zero, so more than I want, but manageable.

    The step up to Tier 5 and 6 is where it stops being practicable unless you play destroyer.

    Tier 5 is five Infernal parts (no Infernal legs available, so even worse) plus an R60, tier 6 is an R70 weapon, but now I am playing at 40+ encumbrance, if that worked for a mage, we would all be doing it already.

    I can see it is risk versus reward but can't you just scale it up please, 4 Infernal, though we would need legs added to the game plus the R60 / R70 ?

    As it stand to get the highest rewards, not only are you risking a lot of gear but nerfing yourself as the extra protections do not scale with the damage lost.
     
  2. turk0lu

    turk0lu Gravelord

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    heavy hybrid or no balls
     
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  3. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Celestial
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    It will be better when tailoring mastery arrives, in the mean time I feel this works decently well because the vast majority of people will never risk tier 5/6 gear anyway and tier 3-4 is very decent loot.
     
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  4. Shivs

    Shivs Crypt Guard

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    I don't agree with this part, I would happily take out Infernal if I am in a decent group and I come across plenty of people wearing some Infernal, it is just impracticable to wear so much, particularly as no Infernal legs.

    It is not a cost thing at this stage of the game.
     
    #4 Shivs, Dec 2, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2017
  5. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Celestial
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    Most people I run into are in robes, bone, or plate, idk, people are usually cheap and risk averse in this game.
     
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  6. Neilk

    Neilk Web Development & System Admin
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    Tier 4 loot already has a much better chance of rare stuff than village tables before last patch.
     
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  7. Shivs

    Shivs Crypt Guard

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    Agreed and don't want to harp on, as the village system has been a great success, my only point is, since the protections offered by the required parts of R60 armour do not match the damage reduction for magic, your not actually encouraged to go for tier 5 and 6 rewards.
     
  8. Rimamok

    Rimamok Earth Elemental
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    Really looking forward to seeing what they do with Tailoring Mastery. It could be a substantial evolution in the game. And with character progression being negligible, there’s never been a more important time for this aspect of the game to be balanced.

    If they do a great job, it might even lure more people back the the game (myself included)
     
  9. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
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    Yes you have a point until we get the high end mage armours in but at the end of the day you are still risking less in value. Tier 3+ is eligible for all the high end rewards including r80 mats, q5 enchants and items like theyril keys. Tier 5-6 give a bit better rewards but tier 4 is pretty high.

    Alternatively we could make tier 4 max until we get the mage armours in but I'm not if that's needed. We'll think on this some more for any tweaks.
     
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  10. Kilrath

    Kilrath Goblin Shaman
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    The way I personally see it is bone with enough top end gear to keep you under 20 encumbrance is no where near the risk a full infernal destro brings to the village. So even though most play mage why should they receive top tier rewards in gear that is only about 30% of the cost of a full destro bag?
     
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  11. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Celestial
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    I agree. We must keep in mind that the tier system is merely a portion of the master plan, when tailoring mastery arrives we will all have the opportunity to risk equally, it is not so bad that we have to wait a while, especially considering how vastly successful the new iteration of villages is. I would be so bold as to say that this is the greatest and most accessible means of finding pvp in Darkfall history, and the most suitable reward system for pvp as well. Instead of constantly encountering people in scroach gear that risk nothing we can now find actual geared people. Due to the accessibility and convenience of the new village system. The real beauty of it all is how competitive the game becomes, now players don't need to duel for hours per day to stay sharp in case they happen about pvp, instead you can find pvp the majority of the time and hone your skills and teamwork in actual combat.
     
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  12. MikeJT

    MikeJT Black Knight
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    I never thought it was a good idea.

    Imagine participating in an open class race. You win it in your Toyota Corolla because you take perfect lines and nail every shift.

    But because your Toyota Corolla is worth less than your opponents Ferrari, your prize money is cut, and you receive only a fraction of what the Ferrari driver would've got.

    Not really fair is it?

    Secondly, the whole purpose of compressing gear difference was to make the game more accessible to new players.

    However linking rewards to hear value basically means you're forcing a new arms race to the top, meaning the most basic level of gear needed to compete has increased.

    Thirdly, rewarding players for wearing more expensive gear is presenting that same "double reward" problem. People are already rewarded for wearing higher end gear with an advantage over their opponents, and now they are rewarded again for winning because they're wearing that gear.

    Its the same in the Corolla/Ferrari example. The person in the Ferrari needs a lot less skill and effort to succeed but is rewarded more for using more expensive equipment.
     
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  13. kinglear

    kinglear Black Knight

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    I think that this isn't a great example considering you are guaranteed to keep the Ferrari at the end of the race.
     
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  14. MikeJT

    MikeJT Black Knight
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    Well unless all your opponent's gear jumps off them and into your backpack when you win, it's still a fair comparison.

    Whilst the race has two possible outcomes, win or lose, capturing a village has multiple outcomes.

    You can win, and all your opponents escape, or you can win whilst killing all your opponents and get their gear. Or, you could win, and then get ganked and lose all your gear.

    Wearing that better gear increases your chances of winning, increases your chances of escaping, increases your chances of defending yourself after the win. You're already rewarded for wearing it.

    It's rewarding the already wealthy, for being already wealthy and simply drives the gap between veterans and newer players.
     
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  15. Oresmacker

    Oresmacker Obsidian Golem
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    Where is your head at?
     
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  16. Rimamok

    Rimamok Earth Elemental
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    Skill has always been much more significant than gear. The current VCP rewards system gives the strong players an incentive NOT to arrive in garbage gear, rather than farming the weak while risking nothing.

    While there is certainly some truth to your arguments, @MikeJT , the “lesser of evils” seems to be a system that gives skilled players an additional incentive to risk losing gear.
     
  17. Dixie Normus

    Dixie Normus Black Knight
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    He’s arguing for the little man. For example new/casual players who might not have access to fp/infernal. Not only are they getting a lot less of a reward, their chances of getting any reward at all are slim to none.

    My wife can’t pvp. She’s terrible. She knows this and no amount of practice will ever change this as she’s not only new to the game but pc games and mouse and keyboard in general. She used to love the thrill of ninja capping villages and getting away. Now she probably won’t do villages anymore. Because she will always die and lose everything.

    She asked me after she read the patch notes a question that I couldn’t answer.

    She asked why everything in the game had to revolve around fighting.


    That being said I love the new village mechanics but again, there’s a lot more than one demographic that needs to be addressed.

    Things needed to be added for casual NON PVP FOCUSED individuals to do if we keep making EVERYTHING about pvp.


    Now go ahead and say the game isn’t meant for non pvpers.

    The reason uo is still up is not because of the pvp.
     
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  18. Cool hwip

    Cool hwip Deadeye
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    Maybe I just got lucky but I did one village in tier 3 gear and got more than others in my group that were tier 4. Small map 3 vele ore and other stuff i don't remember. I don't see the problem here. Was wearing bone/plate and an r50. Hell I think even without the R50 equiped I was tier 3. If you can't manage to throw on this basic set then your just being lazy.
     
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  19. NonFactor

    NonFactor Fire Giant
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  20. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Celestial
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    What is it you dislike?
     
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