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How will PvP work with Racial Wars out of the game?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Drigoroth, Apr 25, 2017.

  1. Vic

    Vic Spellgazer
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    Racial wars are out and we just need to deal with it, but the fact is, this new system is currently in its pre-fetal stage and needs to be expanded upon with the utmost urgency as this has more than anything affected early game pvp, and early game is when the feature is still/will be underdeveloped.
     
  2. Pimptight

    Pimptight Obsidian Golem
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    I want factions when the game releases or there is so much lossed pvp without racial wars
     
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  3. Donaddor Lightbringer

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    Problem with just dealing with it though is that this is out for the wrong reasons, out without any real chance for the community to debate certain aspects, and that ROA is the Darkfall ppl know to go to by default, and DND whether they earn it later or just outlast ROA, will never be the darkfall that was cared for like ROA is suppose to be. If ROA doesn't do good enough, thats it for darkfall. DND is not what alot of players would want as the only darkfall they can choose. ROA shouldn't have done this, would be better off not doing anything on this besides hit protection toggle, and then spending the rest of the time talking to the community about problems they need help addressing.

    They never intended for honest work to be done on this for launch, this is the easy way out, disregard for what is being removed because the carebears will be able to care and the gains from the cradling is suppose to be really really good, when alot of the issues brought up SHOULD HAVE BEEN ADDRESSED SPECIFICALLY. Oh but its ok maybe the lawless zone after they get feedback instead of helping discuss the situation, will likely increase, so all that will be done will mostly apply to smaller areas of the map... completely undermined and pointless if you are just in a lawless zone.

    plz don't start deleting my post I cant help but to feel like I am getting too real. This is just my opinion on the matter, and I want people to know that I believe the good will outweigh the bad, even as I see this as a major bad move, especially when launch is so important. A make or break decision that didn't need to be like this, especially at launch. Look at DND, its a massive mess that isn't going to get sorted out soon, if so, and its not the game ppl loved so long ago, just to have it taken away by AV. ROA is the darkfall most ppl would want since ppl cared about the game more than AV, and ROA cares about the game more than DND. ROA is the last darkfall.
     
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  4. Vic

    Vic Spellgazer
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    This is my maths, agree with it or not, looks legit to me.

    I will use straight 1 race = 1 pop here rather than trying to guestimate the % of who went what

    Back then a:

    1) Alfar - had 5 racial enemies, so a MINIMUM of 5/6 players could be killed ANYWHERE, thats 5 enemies, also possibly more due to red alfar

    2) Ork/Wolf had 4 racial enemies, so 4/6 players can be killed + maybe some reds

    3) Human, Dorf, Elf had 3 racial enemies, so 3/6 players could be killed + maybe some reds.

    Right now you have 0/6 racial enemies, meaning you can only FREELY pvp in remote parts of the map (islands and center), not exactly areas that will booming from the start, and not many people will want to go red at the beginning either. That leaves us with either going red to pvp and not even being able to benefit from all of these "benefits" from no racial wars (more banks, more pve access ect) or you will just have to be blue for a while while you develop your char farm ect, build up your player cities and so on.

    You could always join a clan and then war dec another clan, but generally that should be done for more political reasons rather then just cos you want to pvp.
     
  5. Mycke

    Mycke Obsidian Golem

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    People think game mechanics are the most important aspect and being as close to end DFO is more important than any other issue, but I say in the end its the engine that made DF not the specific mechanics and no matter how forcefully one declares they wont play the 'other game' (going either direction RoA>ND ND>RoA), in the end after both are launched, whichever has the bigger pop as a core will eventually win out, because...

    Population>preferred mechanics
     
  6. Donaddor Lightbringer

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    Those parts of the map is lawless already. Alot of ppl wont have natural pvp when building up their char fro a good while because they would need to encounter reds, rather than just blues looking for pvp on the main land.
     
  7. Vic

    Vic Spellgazer
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    Yeah I know that is also my point lol.

    What I have suggested is to just redraw the lawless areas.

    Make a relatively large area lawful to encompass the starting towns, capital and to have plenty of the spawns in it, and then have smaller areas around the npc cities that are further out. This means that the newbs still have the protection that they need in their early stages, and when they feel brave enough to go for some tougher mobs into lawless areas they can and without the need to go too far from home.
     
  8. Donaddor Lightbringer

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    Yeah I agree and its a shame since I feel alot of pop has to do with preferred mechanics, and the worse thing is when PVPers feel like they can't just pvp. When pop gets low, pvpers are the real population than the passive population that may have more ppl. When the pvpers know that the few locations for pvp is getting smaller and smaller and it takes longer and longer to find pvp, the population feels alot smaller than what it is, and those ppl get fewer and fewer, kinda showing how perception on population is more real than the actual number if ppl are spend more time doign their own thing than creating the PVP content players are suppose to be creating for each other
     
  9. kilrain

    kilrain Shadow Knight
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    I played Eve for the PVP. Enough said.
     
  10. Donaddor Lightbringer

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    I hear that tho I'd probably would make a kind of low stat only safe zone smaller than the lawful area that hugs and connects noob spawns and npc cities, but it will just be regular for anyone without low stats. That way racial wars can exist and noobs can be protected from red/racial reds. Reds right now can still grief noobs, all that really happened was that now theres less natural racial reds, but preventing their hit protection toggle from going through to noobs would be better. That way the odds for racial pvp still exist, which is a good thing IMO. Having 0/6 racial enemies is really bad, and lawless zones should negate racial alignment issues meaning that you can freely pvp in the lawless zones like before.

    Yeah and alot of ppl play darkfall for the pvp and they aren't reds nor should they be treated as the bad guys for wanting pvp that isn't just war decced, or red vs blue, or just in lawless areas. the Racial Wars which was no opt-in allowed for pvp to happen without unjust punishment in areas that is lawful.
     
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  11. Vic

    Vic Spellgazer
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    Racial wars are not coming back though, BPG have made a decision and from it sounds like are sticking with it, what we should be doing is finding solutions on how to move forward.
     
  12. Donaddor Lightbringer

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    Well naturally that happens, finding "solutions on how to move forwards." This is just going to naturally happen aswell, discussing racial wars removal and how some ppl would have liked to keep it and how peopel would want them to go back to it, even if they wont. At launch I suspect this will be one of the big topics that will be brought back up since its natural.
     
  13. Drigoroth

    Drigoroth Goblin Scout

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    I honestly dont care that racial wars was removed. I thought about it and this system is pretty close to how UO was back in the day. I think the only thing that would really add a benefit to this is making a lot of the central map lawless. Like someone above me suggested, make the capital and starter towns in one big bubble, but outside of that, have some good chunks lawless to increase natural PvP. Maybe make the spots you gring to go blue lawless?
    Some areas on the main land need to be lawless, so people don't have to go to the islands.
     
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  14. DarkGhost25

    DarkGhost25 Black Knight
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    Racial wars were crap pvp anyway, let's be real for a second. If you r an into a blue that lived in racial cities there was a huge chance they were a beginner and you'd just slaughter them. A big reason for this is that dueling in racial areas is pretty damn risky and it's worse now because the tower can go crazy and zap you down if you kill a party member.
     
  15. Lakisuria_Moonglade

    Lakisuria_Moonglade Varangian Warthane
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    I bet ya there's going to be a lot of bloodshed day 1. Especially between organized clans trying to secure mob spawns.

    --

    People are going to find their pvp one way or another and I don't think it's as big of a problem as some seem to say it is. Granted I would like it to be much more fleshed out in regards to identifying more enemies by default. Although day 1-10 newbs aren't going to want straight out death battles if they know what they are doing anyway.

    If blues don't kill blues and give each other breathing space they'll step out into the lawless territory and seek out greater riches and ultimately each other. Naturally will encounter the more organized residents that have already claimed hold of the areas.
    --

    Can't really help but think if PvP is the "ONLY" draw to the game then we really need to start out with a hell of a lot more kit and reduce the RPG a fair margin. If a day 1 newb that only wants pvp can't beat a day 100 character and we want this to be a heavy pvp only game then the gap needs closened immensely at least between stat scaling. Unlocking kit can be it's own grind.
     
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    #55 Lakisuria_Moonglade, Apr 27, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2017
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  16. aparks

    aparks Obsidian Golem
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    Still need to be able to buy all your skills spells upgrades and role specs at a chaos city that would fix a lot of this frustration.
     
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  17. Drigoroth

    Drigoroth Goblin Scout

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    You arent getting the issue. The way it is now, there is no natural progression to PvP, people who are new wont be able to dio their feet in, and fight someone in their level, and getting a taste for it. Everyone wasn't PvP ready the day DFO launched, and had all if their knowledge. They fought as they leveled up, gettinf experience.
    PvP is the main draw of this game, and if people can only experience PvP by grinding for weeks and then going to a lawless island, noobies wont stick around. They need to be able to fight people on their level, not have Reds fuck them up.
     
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  18. IsilithTehroth

    IsilithTehroth Gravelord
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    You could always pvp anywhere but with the penalty of taking an alignment hit if you kill your own faction. They should limit the alignment hit area to a radius that encompasses the faction alliance's territory and outside of that its free reign.

    What point is there helping new players now? There is no common enemy. Now new players will just get shit on by people everywhere because alignment is meaningless.
     
  19. Kallin

    Kallin New Member
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    Hello forumfall,

    As a solo - small group pvper this map definitely concerns me. In DFO I would simply log in at my NPC city(home base) and ride a route checking spawns in an opposing race's land. This meant PVP was just a 5-10 minute ride before I could jump someone at a spawn or ran into another roaming player. My best memories of DFO were these skirmishes. Islands are bad for solo PVP for a variety of reasons and chaos cities are terrible to live out of. I won't be taking a 15 minute ride + swim/boat from lawful to the nearest island just to start my route to find a fight. I don't want to join a garbage clan and look at all their naked bank huggers so please do not recommend this. This being said, I'm not sure who I will be able to PVP against. I think this will turn ROA into zerg v zerg and solo players getting jumped at spawns by groups of reds aka zerg vs player. Hopefully this system gets worked out or I don't see myself playing.

    Kallin
     
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  20. Korag

    Korag Evil Eye
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    well this is not quite accurate, as the territories surrounding some holding would in fact be pvp lands assuming the owners made it so, that would at least somewhat increase the size of the lawless zones although I have no idea how big that radius is. I was and still am against removing racial wars but not much I can do about that, so I will have a red to do what I want where I want and a blue alt to do the other crap that needs done.