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"Killing Noobs Is Part Of The Game"

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Marxman, Jul 17, 2017.

  1. RootedOak

    RootedOak Oak Lord
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    I kill noobs all day, then I pm them, "get out of my game, idiot."
     
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  2. MikeJT

    MikeJT Black Knight
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    I suppose they could equalise it by making debuffs remove the 'bottom' hp points instead of the top. That way vets would be just as affect by those debuffs as noobs.
    --- Post updated ---
    Lies.

    We know you're a sweetheart.
     
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  3. Marxman

    Marxman Obsidian Golem
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    In the meantime, the clans who arent complete assholes should in some sense band together and begin protecting noobs and punishing people who mindlessly kill them. We should not wait for the devs to fix this, in many ways they cant fix this, its something we as a community have to fix ourselves ideologically. You know of a clan who kills noobs all the time? Raid them more often, find them at mob spawns of their own, choose them as a target for a siege, etc. Target them in every way and dont worry about showing them honor. These clans should be pointed out and justly vilified. If they want to play the villain, treat them like one. Think of it as a real "Red Vs Blue", not like the artificial RP one that is being set up right now.

    An ally of ours was complaining that noobs were doing asset damage to their grove (because they kept killing that group of noobs everyday) and were crying about how it takes time and resources to rebuild the damage (utterly failing to see the irony in the fact that the noobs they kill everyday ALSO have to spend time and resources rebuilding), I told them during the meeting that they are on their own with that and cant expect my clans support, also that I personally think its hilarious their grove was destroyed by noobs and I wouldnt mind if they destroyed the bank too! This is how noob killers should be treated, they should be treated as people who are doing asset damage or worse. They are doing asset damage to the game itself, which is far worse than doing asset damage to some stupid grove.
    --- Post updated ---
    Aha!! Gotcha!! Caught red handed.
     
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    #23 Marxman, Jul 17, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
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  4. Ledwulf

    Ledwulf Deadeye
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    +1 as of now debuffs are broken anyway as they are affecting new players much more then vets putting them at even bigger disadvantage.
     
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  5. Troy

    Troy Chosen of Khamset
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    I would be running away screaming too, if you came at me.
     
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  6. Lord Zanuul

    Lord Zanuul Spellgazer
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    The game is designed as a pyramid scheme it is a zero-sum game the bottom line is the game is designed around other people being content for the players this is completely unsustainable due to the fact that no one wants to be or I should say no one will be your content and the entire game is designed around this premise ... this is a game first and foremost they can just log off and play something else
     
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  7. MikeJT

    MikeJT Black Knight
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    I wouldn't say this is entirely accurate.

    Plenty of games rely on other players to be content for players. In fact most competitive shooters are based around multiplayer content, not single player.

    Quake, Counterstrike, Battlefield series, Planetside 2, DayZ, H1Z1, PUBG, Rust, Overwatch, LoL, etc are all PvP driven content.

    Biggest difference between that I don't need to grind for hours to unlock the railgun in Quake before I can actually compete with my peers.

    Edit:
    @Lord Zanuul Actually just thought I'd add one more thing.

    Planetside 2 is a great example of PvP driven content that still attracted hundreds of players of all skill levels.

    When I heard PS2 was on the horizon I personally didn't think we'd get an Australian server, but we did, and when we did, I didn't think it would attract too many Aussie players, but it did!

    Planetside 2 had players of all skill levels playing. From hardcore twitch junkies to ESF pilots, to badass snipers who could do little else, to tank drivers to Galaxy pilots to Liberator gunners to Sunderer gunners.

    I played NC and would frequently get myself into Tank-vs-Tank engagements with just about everyone on the server and when I got bored with that I'd run around as Light Assault and wreck people face to face hovering over MAX's to drop C4 and dropping in on people with a GD-7F.

    When I got bored of that I'd jump in a MAX suit and rock double shotguns to push the point and when I'd get bored of that I'd jump in a Liberator and pilot it for a good gunner.

    When I got bored of that we'd switch seats and I'd gun and when I eventually got bored of that I'd go heavy assault and try to sneak up on vehicles to destroy them.

    When I got bored of that I'd sit on a on hill and pick-off threats to my team and communicate with them so they knew what was coming at them. When I got bored with that I'd get in a Sunderer with double bulldogs and bombard high traffic enemy areas from afar getting dozens of kills and hundreds of assists.

    When I'd get bored of that I'd fly and ESF and say "Why on earth did I pull this ESF I can't fly for crap", so I'd pull a Infiltrator with an SMG and ambush people using my cloaking ability to disappear and sneak up on people.

    When I'd get bored of that I'd play medic keeping my team fully healed all the time and using my rifle to engage at longer ranges and when I got bored with that I'd switch to engineer and keep everyone supplied with ammo and those MAX's at full health. When I found myself getting bored with that I'd jump back in my tank and repeat the whole process.

    So was the low barrier to entry the key factor that kept me (and looking at the current statistics for my local server, hundreds of other people) playing for so long or was it the fact that there was so many different things to do in Planetside?

    Probably a combination of the both. But honestly I think more valid ways to play the game is more important than reducing grind further at this point in time.
     
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    #27 MikeJT, Jul 17, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017
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  8. BeatIt

    BeatIt Eodrin
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    some try hard clan that recruited 1-2 noobs then pretend they help the game.
     
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  9. Ron Mexico

    Ron Mexico Fire Elemental
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    I enjoy the mind games. If I kill 3 newbs farming I will gank 2 and res 1 to create conflict between them.
     
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  10. Bartlebe

    Bartlebe Varangian Warthane
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    One of the reasons every version of Darkfall seems to eventually go belly up. Features that could be put into place to protect noobs and ease the harder elements are shouted down by bittervets. Eventually, all the maxed vets grind the newb population down into dust, they eventually stop appearing and the game slowly withers away.

    Happens every time and is happening right now. BPG has no solutions. They haven't figured out how to even release real content yet.

    Huge boom of noobs when RoA launched. Almost all widdled away and vanished now. Good job elite vets. You sure showed them. So hardcore.
     
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  11. Korag

    Korag Evil Eye
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    Don't always know it is a newb until after you have attacked, and not trying to be rude but some vets of the game are still pretty newb when it comes to pvp does that mean if we find 2 newbs killing a 4k mobs that we should let them live? if we catch 3 newbs in a dungeon we should just not fight them? What do they gain by not attacking? they get to keep loot and gain a false sense of security. I am blue and I don't just kill on sight I have come across many people that I have even teamed up with to kill stuff, I have a member of my clan I met in that way, but to just assume someone is a new player and to let them do what they want without fear of consequence is no better for them cause their is always gonna be a newb slayer around
     
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  12. Biceps

    Biceps Infernal
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    thats the reason why ive been saying forever that ANYTHING mastery crafted needs to be ungodly expensive. no1 should even consider taking anything higher than r40 out for anything else but a major siege, not even when its fucking CR7 of darkfall. every new player can have an basically infinite supply of all r40s after 1-2 weeks even if he is solo and crafts everything himself but having enough rare ores so a newb feels comfortable running in r50s or god forbid r60s will take him months of gathering and beeing slaughtered by vets that dont suffer from the same problem cos they generelly loot more than they lose and usually have the better spawns on lockdown so they can make more raw money than the average new player aswell. playerskill gap between a new player and a vet is bad enough as it is. we dont need a massive gear gap aswell.

    also how is the difference between a r40 2h and a r50 2h still like going from r10 to r40. thats just dumb design. the dmg should scale linear while the price of a r50 should skyrocket compared to a r40. like literally 50 times more expensive if not more. whatever it takes to make ppl stop using mastery crafted gear for every day pvp. obviously mob dropped r50s+ need to be removed or made extremely rare and barely better than a crafted r40.

    "but destroyers need minimum FP to compete with a mage" well while this is simply not true when the destroyer is actually really good i guess you cant base the build around the 10 ppl on the server that are capable of pulling it off in a scale/plate mix vs a good mage so the solution here is rather obvious. make plate a full set so they dont have to use scale fillers then fiddle with the numbers so the protections are slightly lower than current full plate. problem solved.

    TLDR: mastery gear should never be used outside of sieges. the fact that keened r50s/r60s have already become the standard for most vets barely 3 months into the game prove that they are WAY too easy to get. make them much much more expensive then delete everything higher than r40 out of everyones bank. drastic step i know, but this should have been fixed before launch.
     
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  13. Korag

    Korag Evil Eye
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    Did you just say make 3 tiers of gear unattainable for the largest % (casual Players) or nearly unattainable? so just make r50's the same as r80's? cause that is another gap. Most of this makes very little sense when you really think about it.
     
  14. Lord Zanuul

    Lord Zanuul Spellgazer
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    And that's exactly why I said they won't be your content because it takes too much effort to be other people's content in this game
     
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  15. Biceps

    Biceps Infernal
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    its not unattainable. its just super fkin expensive. you would still be able to afford 2-3 good siege bags every few weeks but you wont be able to use fully enchanted mastery gear as your standard every day pvp bag. the whole concept of rare ore is utterly retarded as the only decent way of obtaining them is by killing golems which are always contested which might sound great at the first glance because it generates a pvp hotspot but when you really think about it its dumb AF cos who actually benefits from that? exactly, the best players and biggest clans do cos they can keep it on lockdown whenever they please. this essentially gives the ppl that already have the numbers and/or skill advantage also the a gear advantage. so the only viable options are to either remove rare ores from the game alltogether and make everything craftable with normal mats (just alot of them for the mastery tiers) or make mastery tier items so insanely expensive (either by upping the rare mats cost or simply the gold cost) that no1 in his right mind would even consider using it for anything but a 100vs100 siege for an important holding. i think its pretty obvious that stuff made of RARE ore is supposed to be actually RARE. when ppl can have literally 100´s of those things in their bank 3 months into the game that is the exact opposite of RARE. hence they are nowhere near expensive enough.
     
  16. Korag

    Korag Evil Eye
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    Super fucking expensive is unattainable by the masses, the avg player is casual and has a struggle just staying geared, and you want to put 3 tiers of gear out of or nearly out of reach.

    Don't get me wrong for me it wouldn't be a big deal, Socialism doesn't work though not even in a game, some people are going to be much more wealthy than others for several reasons. More efficient use of time, heavy farming, more time to play. This doesn't work it doesn't help anyone it still leave a gap between the rich/no lifers and the casual all it does is make it harder for causal/avg player to get.
    --- Post updated ---
    Also we have different level of rare in case ya did not notice and people do not have 100's of dragons pieces cause that is meant to be much more rare then sele or vel. also rare doesn't mean it is super duper rare it just means it is a lot less common than iron ore witch it is.
    --- Post updated ---
    Oh and one thing I didn't touch on, is that you need to get out more and check the golems, because they are def not camped like you think, I spent a good hour plus killing sele golem in alfar lands last night and did not see a single person. The leenspar on ruby I have soloed many times where I did not see a single person, you might wanna think about getting our more often rather than sitting in your city and making these bold assumptions.

    A good comparison would be gold. Gold is considered a rare and precious metal but it is still super common in the world right? It is not hard to find or get and really not even that expensive, so when someone says rare it does not mean it is a gift from the gods kind of rare it just means that it is less common than other material.
     
  17. Biceps

    Biceps Infernal
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    show me one vet that doesnt run r50 gs/r50 bow in his every day bag. exactly, there are none. when everyone except the newbies can do that its not rare. its common. basic gear that everyone uses everyday should be r40s but right now its r50s, soon it will be r60s. how do you expect a new player to come to the game and catch up in a year? that is the core issue at hand. every day gear needs to be worthless or new players wont bother. UW managed to do that but did it wrong cos the gear that was meant to be high end wasnt worth shit cos rare ore wasnt worth shit. the correct way to do it is make basic gear dirt cheap (which they already did) but at the same time make any mastery gear super fucking expensive so ppl dont use it for roaming when there is a big chance they will just get 10v1´d and lose it.
     
  18. Frog

    Frog Black Knight
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    is it honestly that bad right now? not sure that i've run into someone using an r40 melee weapon for a while now, that includes noobs.

    on the other end of the spectrum it's fairly rare to see r60s in everyday use and i haven't seen anyone with an r70 yet.

    seems like a decent balance atm
     
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  19. Biceps

    Biceps Infernal
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    how many truely new players do you see nowadays tho. most of the actual new playerbase have played for a month+ by now. ask yourself how long will a brand new player put up with getting ganked by ppl that have much better characters, much better gear and much higher skill than them. character gap can be closed quite easily now with the grind beeing massively reduced. playerskill gap cant rly be fixed by the devs so thats on them. the gear gap however takes way longer to close than the char progression gap simply because a new player will lose much more gear than a vet cos his skill is much lower, therefor he needs much more gear to be comfortable to run the same gear as the vets do in an every day bag. if the every day bag was balanced around r40s it would be no problem as even a newb can have a buttload of those within 1-2 weeks of playing but r50s are too expensive for a newb while beeing way too cheap for a vet. hence the mastery gear needs to be so expensive so everyone just uses the worthless gear for every day pvp and the issue is fixed.

    if it stays like it is now it will only get worse and worse as old players will get richer and richer and therefor the entry level gear will move up to r60s/70s which is completely out of reach for a new player for several months. believe me when i say that not a single new player that joins in a year will stay once he realizes that.
     
  20. Frog

    Frog Black Knight
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    when there are more r50s in the world their value decreases, and can be purchased from players/player vendors by anyone - new players included. imo you're making a mountain out of a mole hill, truly new players are never going to compete with vets whether everyone is using an r40 or not. they'll spend their initial few weeks grinding up and building a bank and then they can participate in the economy by purchasing rare ores or exploring the world and obtaining them via villages/golems/mines/etc

    if you substantially increase the cost of mastery weapons then the vets are still going to use them, theyll have enough resources and the skill to keep the weapons. all this will do is make it even harder for new players to obtain equal gear to the vets. if anything then (as you mentioned in a prior post) the damage of an r40 should be increased so that the jump to mastery gear isn't so substantial.
     
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