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Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by clyde frog, Jul 11, 2017.
grind doesn't equal content.
Maybe part of the reason why I really dont devote more time because it's the same result of the same repetitive grind.
there is literally nothing worse than that "interactive" quest grind in mmos. "kill 10 of this", kill 15 of that", "pick 5 flowers", "kill that named". all that while following a red line through zone after zone while doing the exactly same shit but you cant do it efficiently cos you have to return to some retarded quest npc all the time and change spots constantly. lets not even talk about the struggle of dealing with buggy quest scripts or endlessly wandering around to find a named that refuses to spawn at its designated location. seriously worst shit ever invented. i much much much rather shoot 10000 bolts at the same 4 mobs for days than doing that soul crushing quest grind bullshit you find in mmos these days. the ONLY mmo EVER that did it remotely decent was SWTOR and even there you just wanna stab yourself in the eye with a rusty pitchfork once you decide to make alts.
not even going to bother giving you reasons why reducing the grind even more would be bad. this is the 320th iteration of this thread and we have mentioned so many reasons that you could fill a book bigger than the bible with them and you ppl ignore all of it anyway cos your one dimensional brains dont allow you to think ahead and focus solely yourself.
infact with reducing the grind they went full speed into the wrong direction already. with macroing eliminated they should have went back to how the grind was at the original EU launch and triple it then make essences super rare drops so it fits the new level speed. you would be a fucking monster if you unlocked fireball before xmas 2018 then so having an all capped mage would be a pipe dream that would literally never happen. all of a sudden you would have to make choices what kind of character you wanna make cos its not possible to max everything. z0mg diversity while still maintaining full freedom!
I'm currently helping to level my friend who play like 1-2 hours a day and it's pretty manageable in duo on harder spawns. He usually heals me when I'm daggering everything down and we both making a good amount of gold and with gold you can meditate and level nearly everything in game so he's progressing pretty well.
Only thing that troubles me a bit you don't have any int gains from healing so he need to meditate his int even that he's casting a lot. Maybe add a check that you gain a stats when you heal someone not at full hp?
People would still exploit that. I remember macroers who would literally hit someone with melee weapon till they had a slither of health, then heal other/sacrifice until they were full health, repeat.
At this point just reduce the grind so the kids will stop crying about it and we can move on to the real issues imo. Melee grind is atrocious, reduce that and increase stat gain to compensate, and increase the spell school rate like scrubby said. I don't think it will help the quitters because let's face it, 90% of people who quit do it on an impulse after dying. Usually after blaming their loss on character difference or some other arbitrary and untrue factor.
One solution is to increase gold and gear availability while decreasing enchant mat availability. Shift the value to enchants which offer only minor advantages so people still have something to work towards but the add kiddos have all the gear and gold they need to satisfy their inability to work towards and plan for a goal.
An alternate solution (shoot me now) is pay to win. Allow kiddos to buy characters and gearbags with real money while keeping things mostly the same. This gives the no lifers the ability to work and grind for their chars (and people who aren't retarded or have add) while having the option to just rmt whatever they'd like.
People will still quit just as fast as ever when they get zerged at a city and lose a 10$ gear bag with their maxed char because they were blasting edm while streaming to 5 people
How long did it take you to get to max? Do you really know what's its like to play with a low-end character when there's already a bunch of very high powered toons running around?
Pay to win would be horrible. I'd definitely unsub.
I'm happy to get my ass handed to me on a regular basis until I get a character up to spec, but not whilst there's a million and one maxed out toons rolling around.
Darkfall would be broken up into no-lifers and people with money to burn on a game. I bought DFRoA on the assumption that it would cost me $10 a month, not $10 per month plus whatever boost I need to pay for keep up with the pay-to-win crowd.
It's like nat said, the grind is not the problem. Proof is that most of the new players chose destroyers as soon as they learn that they only have to grind melee/archery + stats with them.
It's not that ppl don't like to grind, it's just that ppl don't like to grind everything.
Then again, if a bad player goes destroyer on me, i'll just kick him out the clan.
At the end of the day we can argue MMO vs FPS yada yada grind yada.
Just give these crybabys what they want and let you max out in a day so we can get to the actual issues.
My character is nowhere near maxed, as a matter of fact it's probably lower end in regards to accounts that started 2 weeks after launch. I lost fights all the time, and I mean all the time in the beginning. After 2 weeks I had 56 mastery in 2 weps around 400 hp 75 sharp, and most spells needed to 75. Just recently started winning most fights, including a couple 2vs1s, tbh 2 extra weapon damage and 25 extra hp isn't the reason I've been winning more fights. It's practice, plain and simple.
I encourage grind reduction, it will allow people to fixate less on arbitrary character disadvantages and perceived weakness and focus more on getting better at the game. And contributing more positively in the process. If it's really what the people want, give it to them, so we can get trolls like mycke and mexi horseman off the forums and move on to making the game more well rounded.
I keep telling new players that the difference in 95 GS mastery and 45 GS mastery is literally less then 3 damage per hit.
You can compete with a character who has most skills at level 50, but if you dont know the game or how to play you will lose anyway which adds to the percieved notion that skills to 75 is a requirement.
Honestly I want more melee/archery related stuff to grind, it feels a bit unfair that mages get droves of spells and meanwhile the rest of us just grind melee and archery. I would like to see the gear grind get more advanced, new stuff both cheap and expensive, all the way up to exorbitant and nearly impossible to acquire. A greatsword worth millions of gold, that would be intriguing to me.
I preached this shame shit until I was blue in the face. Nobody is listening. So I quit. Basically waiting for sub to run out. I have a fully ground out destro so I can still play. Just sucks being a destro because its really hard to get great gear. Which is kind of needed as a destro in this game especially when I dont always land my bow shots. Sometimes I do though =] But my protections with plate and scale armour make it really fucken hard to beat a mage.
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Claps my ass off... because this is exactly right. However it falls on deaf ears. So all I can do now is sit back and laugh while I watch the world burn.
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Even if the grind is fine... and its really fucken not. I refuse to do it its such a daunting task to level all magic. Either way even if it is as you say fine. When I log in to my discord all I hear my clan doing, some 20 to 30 players deep, Is them talking about dueling eachother. They sit around and fucken duel for hours. LOL... this is what the game is? Dueling your friends? I sit there and listen to them compare their own dick sizes to one another. Then I realize that I could sit around for hours doing nothing in the game waiting for some pvp to come to me. I could also roam around but most likely solo.. im going to get my brains zerged out. There is no reason to pvp no set place or time to pvp except for village control points. Also a huge fucken zerg fest. There needs to be more reasons for pvp. more organized times for pvp to happen. More reasons for small scale pvp or large. I don't know what the answer to creating these conflicts is but hey... thats not my problem. I will leave that to the devs and hopefully someday I will be enticed to come back and try again.
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Hehe you are a huge troll but a funny one.
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A new player really would not care so much about losing and dying. Its the fact that he has to wait another four hours sometimes to find live pvp situation. If you run around for four hours just to die in 10 seconds that really blows. How do you get good then? The only way is to sit around and duel your friends over and over for days and days and months and years. While you sit around and duel for hours each day hopefully someone comes into your area and you get some real pvp.
However you must never log off... or you will miss the pvp that comes once every four or so hours.
didn't you get the memo? this is an mmo so it has to be as boring as possible. we want the cookie clicker audience.
I'll start with saying I'm fairly casual in the amount of time I can devote to this, and that I don't actually feel the grind is that bad. But a motif in MMOs is reducing the grind as time goes on, in fact I'd go as far as saying it is completely necessary to reduce the grind as the game ages since the distance between new players and old players only grows in time and you need to make it feasible for people to catch up. A couple of months in is maybe a bit soon for needing to do this but you know at a certain point it harms noone to reduce and even to make it trivial. Anyone who powered through the grind at the beginning has had ample time to take advantage of their headstart and the reduced grind only means they'll see more people coming to their level sooner for better fights and a better game in general.
It's a pity the economy is so poorly designed because it would help alot if people were really seriously focused on crafting and equipment acquisition more rather than skilling their character. If we had a more robust economy then something like introducing time-based leveling for some sort of masteries to create a bit of diversity (a la EVE) and trivialising the initial grind to all the necessary spells would really do wonders for the game and its endgame appeal.
Completely this. People love going to see what new spells the Mage has for them. Or what skills the fighter is offering. Giving new players the tool kit quickly gives them the opportunity to learn about how everything works.
The skills are all low level and progress at a regular (current) rate, but it makes the character grind not so daunting. It's rewarding and enjoyable to receive new abilities quickly, and pushes the game toward a gesr grind faster.
I would be for reducing the grind if there was more end game content to occupy people, but there is not. Whether you like it or not grinding is a big part of the content of this game because it increases the chance of pvp encounters. The most fun was when people were at every spawn pveing because it led people to go around looking for pvp at all the different spawns and created a lot of open world pvp. The grind keeps people out in the world on a daily basis, which creates opportunities for pvp. If there is no grind, there is no reason for pve, then there is no reason to roam for pvp. The game devolves into nothing but sieges and city raiding with the occasional sea tower or village or trade route mixed in because that is the only end game content. People log on, see there is no siege or large scale raiding going on so they duel a few times or just log off. I wish the grind was 5x longer than it currently is because I would still be out in the world pveing and getting jumped and jumping people back and roaming for pvp, but instead I don't have much to do.
TL;DR - The game needs the grind unless and until there is more end game content to drive pvp.
Ok just for everyone here, GRIND is not CONTENT. Grind is grind. Content is content, that's why they are two separate words. Content is PVP villages, sieges, sea towers, raiding cities/hamlets, and dungeons etc...
Grind is shooting the same spell at a mob for 4 hours just to make that spell worthwhile in any of the above activities. Grind is hitting nodes for two hours while watching youtube videos on your second monitor.
We need much more content and much less grind.
The lack of variety is the problem: we all have to do it the same way. That's the korean mmo mentality.
In wow, you can do fun stuff all the way to level cap. Yet, there are guides that will tell you to kill the same mob for hours until you reach a certain point on your level. Then, you have to kill the next one for hours. If everybody had to go through boring grind like that, i doubt that wow would be as popular as it is today.
If you think questing is boring, then i'm pretty sure that's an opinion. I went back to nostalrius when DF was offline and i couln't see the time go by from 8am to 8pm. I stopped playing after a week because i knew that wow was going to destroy my life.
Then again, you got the double XP bar progressing if you log-out at a inn.
The game shouldn't accommodate to 90% of its player base and instead should accommodate the no lifers like you??? Well thats the exact logic why this game is dead lol...