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Regionalization, Activity Windows and Seasons

Discussion in 'Design Discussions' started by MWTaylor, Apr 9, 2018.

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  1. Lele

    Lele Goblin Scout

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    Seasons and a clear winner condition would be a great addiction to the game on the PvP side.
    Just take note that if you don't implement a sort of cap (soft or hard) for alliance/guild members y ou will have from first season 1 side that outnumbered with atleast 3/1 ratio the others cause most peoples like call himself victorious and usually don't care competition.
     
  2. negocromn

    negocromn Black Knight
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    Just have spawns and so on change a little before every new season like mentioned originally, no need to complicate things.

    Btw I don't think you are going to have everyone agree with you on seasons. As Rhulvir mentioned, people still think this is Darkfall 2009 somehow. Hope you don't stray too far from the original plans because of feedback, as dumb as this might sound.
     
  3. Copperfield

    Copperfield Black Knight
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    this is a joke?

    darkfall is a mmorpg.. not a pugb server..

    Drop the seasons.. and play presitant territory control war game is the way to go.

    * In order to prevent stale politics and clan burnout *

    Are you guys new to darkfall or what? if darkfall has a good pop.. politics and warfare will come like before..

    Stop trying to add systems or idea's that dont make any sense at all.

    - connect tiles to conquere system
    - make holdings valuable
    - add rare spawns to specific locations to make holdinds more valuable
    - add interactive map

    serieusly can't believe this shit about seasons... Stop smoking that shit please
     
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  4. Grisvok

    Grisvok Skeleton Archer

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    I like the idea of seasons. But more resources just sounds very tedious. Titles and unique gear at the end of a season has been a winning formula in tons of games. Should have rewards like that instead of focusing on resources.

    Overall PvE is still woefully behind modern mmos, I’d fix that problem first if you want new players.
     
  5. zander

    zander Chosen of Khamset
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    4 Month seasons with a two-week "peace window" at the start where no sieges can occur, but asset can occur.

    To make this viable you need to reduce the number of cities in-game. There is too many and it won't drive enough conflict with the current number.

    Each Island should have 3 cities with the remainder being hamlets. Each racial territory on mainland has 2 cities, remainder hamlets.

    Hamlets act similar to control towers that expand your capital cities influence zone, but are easier to siege and a siege on a hamlet can be completed with 6 hours of dropping (DFO shard siege style).

    End of each season every clan maintains their capital cities, but nothing else. You keep a portion of your TCS points so that you are incentivized to play to the end so that you have some points to start-up with next season. Your capital city will also see all its buildings degraded to level 1, except for one building you designate to preserve which is paid with TCS point and Gold.

    I'd also like to see all walls destroyed each season, and potentially add new upgrades to walls. IE cheap to make palisade style (use current palisade hamlet models), upgrade to stone walls(current walls), upgraded to a third tier of higher walls (requires a heavily built up city).

    If a clan owned more than one city by the end of the season, they only keep their capital and all their other cities are up for grabs next season. A clan in possession of a capital city at the start of a season is not allowed to claim any other holdings during the initial two-week peace period (let other clans get a foothold).

    Also TCS points should come from PVP and conquest acitvities, less tied to PVE.
     
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  6. Rhulvir

    Rhulvir Goblin Shaman

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    The problem with darkfall is that it died. Stop trying to emulate that failure.

    I realize that we all loved darkfall, and everyone blames it's death on mismanagement by AV. It's true, aventurine did a terrible job, and were part of the reason DF failed, but the premise of the game itself was such that it wasn't bringing in new players, and only the most hardcore vets remained towards the end.
    Of the 7 good friends I pitched df1 to, only 2 actually tried the game. Of those 2, only 1 played for more than a week. The other guy said "catching up will take too long" and noped out. Of the dozens of random acquaintances I pitched df1 to, not a single one thought the game sounded good enough to try. These were all people that didn't know how bad of a dev team Aventurine were, they just didn't like the idea of the game.

    RoA has a chance to bring in new people, and maybe actually retain them somehow, but apparently the community loves df so much they're willing to let it die outright, rather than see it change.

    Edit: Just to clear something up - I think that persistent server politics are awesome, I truly do.
    But they pose an enormous, sometimes insurmountable entry barrier to new players that want to get into the game. Not every new player is going to want to join Red or Blue team when they start playing the game. That is exactly what persistent servers lead to, 2 big clans/alliances at odds with each other, each holding roughly 50% of the map, with no room for any competition (as all competition was absorbed by one of the sides). The only thing this really works for is to gather up the dying population and set them up to fight each other, it doesn't work to get new players in, or to keep them hooked. What if the new guy doesn't want to be Red or Blue? He/she wants to start the Green alliance and aim for world domination. Obviously, this isn't possible, because the established alliances will destroy any competition, and then whine for hours on the forum about how "there's nobody to fight". So new guy up and leaves the game within a month, because there's nothing for him to really do. Queue forumfall whine wars "server is dying wtf".
     
    #46 Rhulvir, Apr 10, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2018
  7. SomeBK

    SomeBK Infernal
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    My vision of a PubG/Rust version of Darkfall is coming.

    PubG this bitch let’s gooooooooo!!!!!
     
  8. Rethgar

    Rethgar Goblin Shaman

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    I like the idea of seasons but the true question is how to apply that concept to Darkfall as we have come know it. The objective is to find the happy medium for everyone. An idea would be to let the main city stand but anything expanded upon be destroyed. It takes a lot of time to build up a city, people only handle so much rebuilding.

    Now if persay, cities are no longer preset. Imagine an Agon, just A NPC city per race, the rest of the map a clean slate for players to stake out areas to build upon...That would be more fitting for a wipe every so often but to be honest its a mixed bag in a pandoras box.
     
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  9. Aristos Giannes

    Aristos Giannes Cairn Giant
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    It depends on how "painful" the grind is. Games like PubG are insanely popular now and are basically incredibly fast repeated grinds. If Darkfall's grind were to be both addicting and rewarding timewise, it wouldn't feel painful and progress would be fun each time.
     
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  10. zander

    zander Chosen of Khamset
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    Fewer cities in the game to force conflict between those few (but still preset locations). Hamlets act as "outposts", easier to siege, required to capture before siegeing a capital city.

    Those clans without a holding can declare support for Server factions, replacement of the old racial alliances. Would love to see a blue player alliance based out of starter towns and a red player alliance based out of chaos cities. Obviously these can't be capped, but give them outposts which can be, just like each capital city should have outposts that they expand out from their city.

    These blue & red alliances can cap cities just like any other "clan", but they do so with a random assortment of clans allied to their faction, who once declaring their support for a faction will be informed of any siege timers for their faction. Also you must be the corresponding alignment to align yourself. A blue clan must all be blue, a red clan will all become red once aligning to the Red alliance.

    Racial Capitals and Chaos cities would be un-siegeable, but if the blue or red alliance captured a player city it could be retaken. If captured by the blues it becomes exactly like any other starter city with the stronger guard towers, which are disabled when a siege is dropped (outposts do not gain these benefits).

    Obviously the blue & red alliance sieges would be a mess, Reds would be comical, but it would at least give those smaller clans a dog in the server politics. They would most likely be relegated to small-scale outpost "sieges", rather than ever getting enough coordination to challenge a capital city.
     
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  11. Battle Smurf

    Battle Smurf Oak Lord
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    I never liked seasons in any game i always quit after the first one (or avoided them)

    Sounds like you're trying to make this a Darkfall PUBG or Crowfall and that's not what i came here for or what it was supposed to be

    I want a medieval fantasy version of EvE, but with fps/tps combat

    It's entirely possible that there is a target audience for the game type you describe though
     
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  12. Quin Tessence

    Quin Tessence Black Knight
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    The grind gone, now its just fighting to keep your key bindings
     
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  13. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
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    Seasons or moreso a "reset" mechanic that would allow the conquest portion of the to have a fresh start is what came out as an issue in design. We've all seen a server war and it is temporarily fun when two mega clans fight it often ends with one being devastated and players leaving. This burnout issue is one we are trying to address. Another issue is both exit points to take a break and entrance points for new groups to get in on the ground floor.

    We aren't trying to grasp at any specific game mode in other games we're looking for an elegant solution that will address these points and still fit into the game at least somewhat organically.
     
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  14. Rethgar

    Rethgar Goblin Shaman

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    I know the current population at the moment doesnt support a larger map like how EVE is but hopefully it picks up down the road to the point where Agon could be expanded out beyond the current map, perhaps another mega continent that has all climates but thats merely my imagination running.
    In EVE it was amazing seeing two mega corps clash and it seemed to happen fairly often.
     
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  15. Lahmage

    Lahmage Deadeye
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    or you can keep the game as it is now with the same 500 people playing. It needs to change if you want to attract a new audience
     
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  16. Lord Zanuul

    Lord Zanuul Spellgazer
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    then the entire build process would need to be almost free from a resource standpoint ... it couldn't be arduous in any way shape or form or it will defeat the whole purpose of people going through the whole process to build the TC mechanisms
     
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  17. Battle Smurf

    Battle Smurf Oak Lord
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    Obviously option 3 is the best

    You removed character "grind". Now you need to replace it with more long term perpetual item/ resource/ upkeep for territory control to FORCE players to go out and continue FIGHTING over very IMPORTANT and LIMITED resources and OTHER BUFFS/ADVANTAGES

    Scarcity of "worth it" resources/ advantages is what drives conflict

    @Andrew and BPG YOU need to decide what kind of game you're going to be

    Do you want to cater to the "ultra leet FPS player skill is everything I'm just here for the bang for bragging rights let me que up for even fights" crowd?

    OR

    Do you want to cater to the actual traditional sandbox (AND Themepark for that matter) MMORPG crowd where perpetual progression via more powerful gear/ resource control/ conquest (with actual useful buffs/ passive income to encourage it) and the great fps combat is just a nice side factor and fights arnt ONLY all about being "fair and on equal terms" where player skill is the only real factor

    Because I'll tell you there are a LOT more bad players than there are great ones when it comes to FPS skill

    And PERSONALLY if i wanted the former there are WAY better options already available that i'd already be playing with better faster mechanics and much higher populations

    I'm sick to fucking death of these kids calling every traditional mmorpg progression feature "Tedious"

    Darkfall IMO should be MORE than just FPS fair fights...

    Logistics, strategy, TIME SPENT/ EFFORT put in, Risk vs Reward, politics, player reputation ALL THESE THINGS should be equally as important

    If you lack FPS skill then you should be able to counter that by putting more time into acquiring significantly better gear or buffs to give you the advantage

    Good people in fucking purple robe dog shit cheap ass gear bags shouldn't be able to kill a bad player in infernal 1v1. That's the exact opposite of proper RISK VS REWARD

    Darkfall is the only game in history with a community so autistic that they actually criticize you for "out gearing" or having other advantages that you EARNED over your opponents in PvP videos

    These people are ULTRA NICHE BPG

    Figure out what your target audience is FIRST and stick to a gameplan on how to acquire or retain people in that category regardless of what people bitch about on the forums. You CANNOT please both groups (although there is crossover) some people are NOT going to be interested in the vision, so tell them what you're going for and to either adapt or find a new game that offers something they DO want

    Right now we're all in Limbo trying to figure out what the future of RoA is supposed to look like

    Is it a persistent sandbox mmorpg with FPS/TPS combat OR is it going to be something else?
     
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    #57 Battle Smurf, Apr 12, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2018
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  18. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
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    Yes this is what would happen if we went with a regular season. Costs would be considerably cheaper on building and time would be moreso the factor that prevents quick world ownership. Upkeeps would keep networks expanding too quickly and straight time to capture tiles with it taking a day or two per claim. The whole cost and upkeep structure will vary on how we implement seasons if any. We will implement TCS first and once we are happy with it's functionality consider the seasons or a reset mechanic for the system.
    --- Post updated ---
    We of course will decide the future course of the game, do not confuse keeping the community feedback involved in OUR decision process as anything else. Of course we decide the final implementation and direction but it would be detrimental to outright ignore your game community's feedback. We simply like discussion as better ideas can come out from it as well as players knowing where the game they support is going.

    Most of the reason for design threads is pseudo announcing upcoming features specifics but also to get feedback. We heavily debate 99% of anything that we officially release(With the occasional one off idea usually by yours truly thrown out there :p). Dynamic Territory ownership and large clans or alliances vying for control of them is going to be one of our main features and that's been decided. While we already had a specific direction in mind prior to posting these design threads we want to follow through with our project's original promise of transparancy and community feedback involvement.

    Community feedback helps shape the game but we're still the artisans at the pottery wheel ;)
     
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  19. zander

    zander Chosen of Khamset
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    Instead of seasons why not just focus on a more enduring city-building process and territory control?

    Reduce total number of holdings in-game so that clans have to fight over a more scarce number of holdings, rather than getting complacent with the status quo.

    Make holdings take both a gold upkeep cost as well as some form of activity to maintain a hold on, so inactive cities are freed up, and their local areas have activity.

    Make holdings more customize-able through what you build. IE. Expand on building options, but add a cap to how much you can build so that one city can't have everything. This way cities can be constantly changing their buildings depending on what sort of advantages they want at that time.

    Tied in with your TCS system with regional control, you don't need seasons because scarcity will drive the conflict.

    Also make siegeing holdings not directly linked to your capitals via allies or your own assets very difficult and unlikely to occur. Limits the ability of one clan to become dominant over the entire map as they need to build their web out instead of just jumping straight to taking the capitals of rival alliances.
     
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  20. wtblife

    wtblife Goblin Warrior

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    I agree with most of this although you have to be careful about making them more scarce. This would lower the chance of smaller clans having anything.
     
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