Welcome to the Rise of Agon Community

Create an account today to engage in discussions and community events on the Rise of Agon forums.

Remove fall damage debuff. Why? See below!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by soulpcbr, Sep 26, 2019.

  1. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
    Staff Member BPG Representative

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,954
    Likes Received:
    4,479
    There's some misunderstanding in those posts probably because of a lack of context due to the snip. Metalkon wasn't involved in combat changes on a design front, most final decisions were made by myself or TJ. Just blame me as the RoA project is my responsibility ;).

    Sprain was designed as a distance limiter for 2 reasons:
    1) Prevent endless hopping for tile after tile. This made it that as soon as a player was spotted a good hopper could catch a mounted user regardless. This was to curb that ability so mounts had more value as an escape mechanism at distance.

    2) Prevent escape from a fight when you are at critical levels of stats. In this scenario the one hopping away from a fight at critical stats had tons of reward to gain with little risk at that point. The one who likely was winning the fight by having a stat advantage has to burn that advantage in order to finish the runner. Their risk is massive as they burn their earned advantage to chase opening themselves up to significantly higher health stat loss.

    We believe these two areas that were corrected are healthy for the game because endless harassment by elite players against groups of average players caused a lot of frustration. As soon as spotted an average player would be caught up to and likely killed unless in close proximity to a tower. We believe that just because you see a player in the distance doesn't mean you have the right to force them to engage. That's what point 1 is about.

    The second is that the risk vs reward is heavily skewed in the losing player's favor favour when bunny hopping away at critical stats. Unless you catch that elusive spell or arrow before they disappear into the horizon you need to hop after them leading to fights going over many tiles in some cases. This was a big, legitimate in our opinion, complaint about fights being draining because of this and why we added sprain.

    My question is this: Is this mechanic working as intended to address these two concerns or is there a complaint that it is causing other real issues in combat?
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    Not_Primetime and soulpcbr like this.
  2. Yomi Scythetalon

    Yomi Scythetalon Cairn Giant
    Legend Streamer Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2016
    Messages:
    2,798
    Likes Received:
    3,058
    Dont listen to em Andrew, they know movement was cancer before. Plus when you guys finally get rid of the real plague of the game (AHK) the toxic people who "think" they are elite wont be around to poison Agon anymore ;)
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr and Methodico like this.
  3. Scrapnotcrap

    Scrapnotcrap Eodrin
    Hero

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Messages:
    2,138
    Likes Received:
    1,050
    1:
    i can b-hop tiles after tiles. You don't get that much fall damage no more from b-hopping. It's not like we still have the super begone that only works east/north. That one used to deal a lot of fall damage. For that reason, some players capped it at 50 back in DFO.
    You brought-back b-spikes. That means you get so little fall damage as you b-hop.
    This brings us to the next point ''combat'' issue. as a chaser, you spawn your own mount after him. so you can start with 100% stamina when his mount is getting tired. That part is pretty bad honestly: which is the reason we don't like the stam system on mounts.

    2:
    That's the problem. In a 1on1, it's all good, but when you got multiple good b-hoppers against you, it's over sooner than it should be: especially when you getting jumped at the theyril golem which has honestly made me become a lot more aware of load-lags(because ppl duo that shit).

    ...

    The obvious solution ''for me'' would be to remove bunny hop entirely, to remove mount stam and to remove blue tails too. that's ''for me''. With that, your concerns are taken cared of already. Ppl would have to use terrains. If you not in range to hit your opponent, you can't make him scroll left and right which would guarantee his escape if on a mount. That works for top players and noobs alike.

    But if you really wanna keep bunny hop, revert everything as your current solution is bad on all fronts. DF is the only game i know where bunnny hopping is a must anyway. You not going to keep a lot of players with that. You need to ask yourself this: Do you want to alienate your entirely player-base into that whole bunny hop exploit or not?

    ...

    Remember, we went from 300k forum members down to what?
    Beside the horrible grind, bunny hop was one of the reason most players left. We had a poll on that. Lack of content had the least votes if i recall because ppl were too busy grinding to worry about content back-then.
    I'm not seeing nobody that used to complain so much about bunny-hop no more. They are all gone except me.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  4. Yomi Scythetalon

    Yomi Scythetalon Cairn Giant
    Legend Streamer Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2016
    Messages:
    2,798
    Likes Received:
    3,058
    I would just like to remind the community that everything anyone says is purely opinion based on what they think combat should be. Do not assume just because you think something that got changed is ridiculous therefore your reasons why it needs a revert is fact.

    That is all continue the great discussion.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  5. Buffalo Spaceman

    Buffalo Spaceman Frostjarl
    Hero

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2016
    Messages:
    966
    Likes Received:
    1,351
    HOW ABOUT YOU FUCKING MORONS JUST LET THEM MAKE THEIR GAME? HUH? EVER THOUGHT ABOUT THAT? EVER THOUGHT THAT YOUR CONSTANT NON STOP WHINING AND CRYING AND BITCHING AND TRYING TO MICRO MANAGE THESE GUYS HAS GOT US TO WHERE WE ARE NOW? SHUT THE FUCK UP AND PLAY WHAT THEY GIVE YOU, ITS PRACTICALLY THE SAME FUCKING GAME AND ALL YOU FUCKING IDIOTS STILL PLAY IT REGARDLESS OF WHAT THEY DO, SHUT THE FUCK UP.

    Thanks for listening to my TED talk.
     
    soulpcbr, Sero and Yomi Scythetalon like this.
  6. SuB ZeRo

    SuB ZeRo Frostjarl
    Legend Lifetime

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2016
    Messages:
    920
    Likes Received:
    2,854
    Toxic @GM Ibis
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  7. Featherbeans

    Featherbeans Celestial
    Contributor Hero

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    605
    Likes Received:
    421
    Would you like to poll your TED talk with double negatives, Shadow?
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  8. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
    Staff Member BPG Representative

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,954
    Likes Received:
    4,479
    That's more like a TED SCREAM :D.
    --- Post updated ---
    It sounds like the points you raised are more of a Mount Stam issue than bunny hopping. If you are fighting 1v2 or more you are going to be at a severe disadvantage that's just the nature of non consensual PvP. If we removed forms of skillful movement every encounter would end mostly the same way I suspect: running away on a mount.

    We are discussing the mount stamina system that's a topic that I think is worthy of discussion. TJ and I discussed it yesterday actually during a phone call among a few other design points. We've wanted to make changes there for a while it just keeps getting pushed back.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr and Scrapnotcrap like this.
  9. Yomi Scythetalon

    Yomi Scythetalon Cairn Giant
    Legend Streamer Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2016
    Messages:
    2,798
    Likes Received:
    3,058
    Canadians are not normally like this. But its a good message.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  10. Scrapnotcrap

    Scrapnotcrap Eodrin
    Hero

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Messages:
    2,138
    Likes Received:
    1,050
    no we dont. destros are op. if they were balanced, i would be playing every single day.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  11. Yomi Scythetalon

    Yomi Scythetalon Cairn Giant
    Legend Streamer Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2016
    Messages:
    2,798
    Likes Received:
    3,058
    Weird I thought the most recent changes made us not .... OP. Hmm silly I guess.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  12. Sero

    Sero Gnoll Vilegaunt
    Loyal Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2016
    Messages:
    6,924
    Likes Received:
    9,049

    REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.

    PS: You're both right and wrong. The playerbase is not the reason were at this point, and we shouldnt shutup because this forum is where we are suppose to talk about the game supply player feedback for the devs.

    But you are right that they do what they want and there isnt much we can do about it, except use our voice on this forum to help explain things. (again, what it was designed for.)

    Also incase you havent looked around, not many of these people are "still playing despite changes."
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    #32 Sero, Sep 29, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2019
    soulpcbr likes this.
  13. TyteDaddyTite

    TyteDaddyTite Obsidian Golem
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2016
    Messages:
    1,606
    Likes Received:
    2,839
    It's almost all the stuff your vets told you was a bad idea really was... full revert of combat... throw the godamn poker tables, shark mounts, dyes, TCS, actual unique rare drop loot, relics etc into the game. Fuckkkkkkk.
     
    soulpcbr likes this.
  14. lamigra

    lamigra Gravelord
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2015
    Messages:
    243
    Likes Received:
    221
  15. Kol Taggar

    Kol Taggar Infernal
    Loyal Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2015
    Messages:
    579
    Likes Received:
    515
    what the f is a fall damage debuff
     
    soulpcbr likes this.
  16. Fenrir Frauki

    Fenrir Frauki Undead Dwarf
    Loyal Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2015
    Messages:
    202
    Likes Received:
    145
    I thought they reverted combat, why is this still a thing?

    And let me guess, they 'reverted combat' but normal mounts still have nerfed HP.

    They seem to have a really hard time distinguishing between the vocal minority, and the people who have played literally every iteration of DFO and ROA. If they could tell the difference, they would have never even considered touching bhopping.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    soulpcbr likes this.
  17. Scrapnotcrap

    Scrapnotcrap Eodrin
    Hero

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Messages:
    2,138
    Likes Received:
    1,050
    Mounts are not combat related. What you talking about lol? This guy...
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  18. soulpcbr

    soulpcbr Infernal

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2016
    Messages:
    516
    Likes Received:
    624

    In Darkfall mounts are combat related. Check @Itwas Luck, @ArrowExpert , @Squanto videos, there are several fights that they use mount to reset.

    They did not reverted the mount. It was better that they had not reverted buffself.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    Fenrir Frauki and Scrapnotcrap like this.
  19. MikeJT

    MikeJT Black Knight
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Messages:
    1,120
    Likes Received:
    572
    People still debating this?

    Wow.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  20. ijharb

    ijharb Celestial
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2016
    Messages:
    618
    Likes Received:
    865
    spraining is stupid.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature