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Runestones and P Shards Back to Vendor!!!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by quietnoobz, Jan 24, 2019.

  1. Inositol

    Inositol Obsidian Golem
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    You're applying real world economics to virtual world economics. There are key differences, the biggest one being gold sinks. It doesn't matter how easy materials are to farm if the surplus of gold is so great that no one has any incentive to earn more gold. For virtual world economies, currency needs to be treated as commodity with inherent value.

    Think of it like this: If every player suddenly had 1million gold right now, very few people would be willing to sell items for more gold. If no one is selling, then gold has no inherent value outside of... you guessed it, gold sinks, such as regs and portal shards. Increasing the demand for gold via gold sinks encourages people to sell items / participate in the economy, it also incentivizes niche farming for market demand. This cycle perpetuates and compounds itself, but only if there is a high demand for raw gold, and the only way to create that demand is via creating inherent value through gold sinks.

    Even when gold sinks are in place, these sinks can easily be overwhelmed by an overabundance of gold faucets, as seen with reagents and the current inflation of gold after the removal of shards from vendors, and subsequent addition of villages as another gold faucet.

    Like I said in my original post - The sacrifice of portal shards as a player driven commodity is a small price to pay for the overall health of the economy. By creating the inherent demand for gold that portal shards did, every other transaction that took place was encouraged.
     
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    #41 Inositol, Jan 26, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2019
  2. Korag

    Korag Evil Eye
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    They are similar enough and it holds true in the game for the most part. Yes a gold sink helps keep economy stable but a market item and one that really has potential to directly affect the market should not be the gold sink being used. Lower drop rate of reagents and increase the cost too 6 per like ash used to be. That to me makes more sense as it is already available on a vendor.
     
  3. Inositol

    Inositol Obsidian Golem
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    The only kind of item that has the ability to create a strong gold sink will inherently be a high demand item. Portal shards were such a good gold sink because they are such a universally sought after item. We're talking about the literal crux of the economy here, every potential benefit of portal shards as a player driven commodity are overshadowed by the entire rest of the economy.
    --- Post updated ---
    I agree that regs should be lowered as drops too. As far as gold sinks go, I'd say the more the merrier. As gold deflates, newer / poor players are able to buy things with gold earned in less efficient ways, at less contested spawns. It's ridiculous that I am able to make 150k~250k per hour via farming non-liquid items, while newer players are stuck farming liquid mobs and are barely able to afford anything on the market with current prices.
     
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  4. Korag

    Korag Evil Eye
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    every game I know of benefits veterans that know the game more so than newer players I do not think that is really avoidable based on skill and knowledge and even you know that few can farm the same as you do, despite what many might think there is some skill involved. I know how to farm and have taught a lot of people but many still cannot do it as effectively. Portal shards and rune stones were never a gold sink before the time they made them that way. Even in dfo I used runes as much or more than I do now with rune books so I do not think that this is as big of or as important of an item as you think it is.
    Other areas and or things that can be done to create a gold sink that would suffice.
     
  5. Dylan

    Dylan Goblin Scout

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    Did not know that, thanks!

    Also I think I would be more on board for portal shards being drops if they were consistent or from certain mobs. From what I've noticed they just drop randomly from anything.

    I can also see the side of portal shards being more valued and making holdings more valuable given their location, I just think as of right now it isn't a very.. practical change. Either that or it isn't fully fleshed out and the idea of removing from the vendor is 'too slow'. What I mean by that is - it doesn't seem like they made the extra step to provide a new way for obtaining them consistently, or from something specific.

    Again being new I don't know the full changes of what they did. I just know what I've experienced. Portal shards rarely drop, and in turn I use my rune book less meaning I travel to other places less.

    As for the people saying that enjoy the travel from Point A to Point B.. I don't know. It seems kind of dull to me. Yeah I can pick up /some/ useful things along the way but I've never ran into another player while traveling to a destination. Usually it was -at- the spot it self, or when I'm super close to a holding. That's about it really. Maybe (like someone said earlier, sort of) if lootables were better somewhat, I would be more inclined to travel. But for now it just is an unnecessary time sink (For me).

    Sorry if I come off as impatient or wanting instant gratification. Just coming from another game where the predominant travel method was by foot and it took forever to get anywhere most of the time for nothing just got old. Very, very quick.
     
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  6. nightblighter

    nightblighter Akathar
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    Portal shards don’t drop randomly. They drop from mage type mobs. Check out the malaut acolytes and beguilers in western human lands for a bunch of good spawns. The broadherne dungeon west of sanguine has a 2 spawn where you can get 10 per hour.
     
  7. Volfen

    Volfen Infernal
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    No, there are mobs that have a much higher drop rate than the rest.
     
  8. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    All I know is I was perma broke when portal shards were on vendors.....now im sitting around 1 mil gold all the time
     
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  9. nightblighter

    nightblighter Akathar
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    I want to know why you don't just buy every portal shard on the market? You had ~0 gold when portal shards costed 1000 gold. Now portal shards are 2800-3500 gold and you have 1 million gold in the bank. There are 99 shards on the market buy them and go wild. You were fine being broke then, be broke now!
     
  10. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    I have ~250 portal shards from doing villages

    haven't farmed any mobs
     
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  11. nightblighter

    nightblighter Akathar
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    Fair enough. But then why say you were perma broke when portal shards were on vendors when the step change really happened when they revamped village loot?

    Seems like the people complaining about portal shard drops should do more villages, unless they are just porting way more often than you do. There are plenty of uncontested villages so it shouldn't be that hard.

    This gets at one of the problems with foisting lots of economic problems on the portal shard change: it wasnt the last change they made. They revamped village loot shortly after, and then they revamped trade route loot, and then they revamped the distribution of mob spawns. All of these things have effects that could easily dwarf the portal shard vendor change.
     
  12. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Varangian Warthane
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    There has always been a large portion of Darkfall players that did not partake in trade much, especially on the market. You said yourself, if new items get added you'll farm them yourself rather than buying them from the market. A lot of people don't even know how to use the market, there are plenty of people with the "hoarde everything, farm everything myself mentality". I have heard people say gold is worthless in all iterations of the game and I have always found it to be untrue as I could continue buying tons of top quality stuff. The reason people will only accept rare items at times is not because gold is worthless, it's because they are not the type of players to bother reinvesting their newly acquired gold. As for the value of the market as a sink, it varies greatly from player to player. Yes, I know it's not equivalent to portal shards on vendors but it does help.

    I agree with your point about encouraging market usage and market participation being low. I came back to the game a few months ago and the market was practically dead, but once I started getting involved more I noticed that many others did as well. I do think new materials and items will greatly enhance market activity and help to purge out a plethora of gold.

    Regardless of what you or your alliance says, some people do like running trade routes, they are already in the game, and it makes sense to improve them. It has nothing to do with me being out of touch, and everything to do with you being closeminded and frustrated. As for your final point, I would say game design 101 is about providing rewards for activities that people want, which isn't the case with trade routes. Without new items or the ability to pick and choose rewards, most players will never enjoy them, it always boils down to gold per hour and it would be silly if trade routes were the top choice for profit. A big part of what makes an activity in a game fun is the reward you get for doing it, not just the activity itself. If, for example, trade routes have a chance to drop a castle deed or a ninja gi, the fun factor would be a lot higher.

    As for whether or not these items get added back to the vendor, I honestly don't care. Most things seem to have a demand for being reverted anyway, we are moving backward more often than forward because people complain about everything. That is not me saying that it's a bad move, just expressing my annoyance with the state of things. I have fun playing the game and I like the patches overall, it's just depressing to keep seeing threads about reverting things. I know people can say that the changes are bad but I think that people will complain about everything in every patch almost unconditionally.
     
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    #52 Billy Lee, Jan 26, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2019
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  13. Sero

    Sero Gnoll Vilegaunt
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    This thread:

     
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