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Dev thread Village Feedback Encouraged

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Billy Lee, Jan 8, 2020.

  1. Volfen

    Volfen Celestial
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    upload_2020-1-10_10-20-5.png
    Another example of a Khalbun village cap. I think last 3 of my t6 caps in this village have been roughly the same.
     
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  2. NonFactor

    NonFactor Forest Golem
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    already told them about khalbun.

    awful t6 rewards
     
  3. rikilii

    rikilii Celestial

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    • Put more on the board. There should pretty much always be a village people can go to to fight over.
    • Limit the reward to a single amount for the entire winning party. Without a reward limitation, a lot of people just party up to share the capture, instead of fighting over it, because they'll get the same amount no matter what. Optimize the reward for about 3 people -- that's a relatively easy number to get together for quick PVP, and it's not too many that someone who solo-captures in off-hours will get too much.
    • Get rid of the gear score mechanic, and just put more (or all) villages on the board. If someone can capture it naked because nobody showed up, so be it.

    We don't need "land towers," we just need villages to be worth fighting over.
     
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  4. Scrapnotcrap

    Scrapnotcrap Eodrin
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    No. I understand the argument that ''we here for a fight'' but we need some motivation to make that happen.

    You explained the reason vcp's should never only give gold. So that pvpers can fill-up the market for the rest of us. All aspect of Darkfall ROA should promote ''trading''.

    No, we just have to take away any profitable reasons to bring alts. Once this is done, i doubt anyone would even bother bringing alts as fear tactics. At this point, it would be trying too hard: turning vcp's into pve when you could have been farming with alts instead for more loot.

    I like this. I was against it at the beginning, but alts is a bigger issue. This solution can fix that.


    I just think it should be easy to reach the highest tier. The main reason we go to vcp's is to find a guaranteed fight. I think FP helm and 2 more fp pieces should give you full reward. Robes should probably give you nothing and you shouln`t even be allowed to cap a point.
    Personally, i cap vcp's naked just to clear it. That way, i can farm the spawn around it with no worries. I shouln't be allowed to cap a point when i'm naked.

    I want mixed VCP's: portables, none portable, vulnerable to siege damage(plus none portable).
     
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  5. Slayven

    Slayven Eodrin
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    It’s difficult to find incentives to vcp at this point in my opinion.
    --- Post updated ---
    The old Darkfalls
    There was a really good reason to do villages and that was for clan gold..
    A little to the player that capped it and some went to clan bank..
    It was used and needed back then any way to make this type of said system back..
    It was good siege money that the clans that I was in relied on a lot..good incentive to go to keep clan funds rolling in for clan warfare
    Semi afk funds rolling in
     
    #45 Slayven, Jan 10, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2020
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  6. Billy Lee

    Billy Lee Loremaster
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    There are many conflicting opinions on villages, as Kantor said. So I will outline what I feel, after reading everyone's posts, makes sense. Let me know what you think.

    1. Disable global announcements of party size but keep the announcement of a village being captured. See if it works out well, if not, turn it back on.
    2. Each village is worth a fixed amount of gold. This stops the alt abuse and encourages, but not forces, appropriate group sizes for each village. To prevent the burden of having to distribute loot manually, the gold is evenly distributed among the victors.
    3. Keep village porting. Need more feedback on what the best way to set it up is. Make all active villages able to be ported to? How many active at a time? Etc. Ideally, each time new villages go live there should be a variety of values to accommodate different group sizes. For example, 1, 2, 5, and 10.
    4. Gear score should play a somewhat important role. Perhaps your split of the loot is reduced by every point of gear score below 6. -10% per point? So Tier 6 is worth 100% loot share, Tier 1 is worth 50%.
    Something to consider is that the removal of items from village loot allows us to make adjustments much quicker and ensures that everyone involved on the winning side gets roughly the same reward. In the future, perhaps certain items could become a part of village loot, ideally completely new items. I am just mentioning this now to clarify that the door has not been shut on the possibility, but as it stands right now, pure gold seems to make the most sense.
     
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  7. BeatIt

    BeatIt Eodrin
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    1. that would be nice to try

    2. no but reduce none sub account to tier 2 loot

    3. 2 village per board open every 30 min, 1x Sub island villages in lawless and1 main island village. SUB island loot should be better.

    4. nah keep the tier 1 to 6 its good
     
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  8. The Red King

    The Red King Obsidian Golem
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    This is a good start with the exception of I think more items should drop in addition to gold at vcps, Dyes, rares, keys, maps etc. not less. Just keys and maps need to have their loot addressed as well.
     
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  9. Raap

    Raap Wildtribe Mage

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    Don't give the loot to only the party leader, you're just adding tedium. No one wants to split beans every village capture.

    Loot-wise, static rewards are a little boring, but completely random is also not good as it exposes you to both extremes. A solution exists in the middle; Thematic loot tables. Sea village in a red zone? High tier fish and naval related loot. Alfar lands village in a yellow zone? Mid tier... mushroom... related loot.

    I'd also argue yellow zone villages should be aimed more towards character progression rewards - so things that can be used to skill up combat and crafting skills. Scribing materials are particularly interesting here.

    Loot tiers should also be reconsidered somewhat. Currently, yellow zones got this stigma where, due to their T3 limit, they are 'shit'. But by changing the loot tables to something more carefully created and thematic per village, you can say every village in the game only has X tiers, and whatever the maximum tier for that village is, would be the best loot it can give, on par with value from villages in other zones - just that the value can differ from player to player, since a veteran sees less value in progression items than a non-veteran, etc.

    Teleporting from billboards should be limited to the area the billboard is located in, however, Sanguine and other NPC cities should continue porting to red zone villages, or have those billboard removed from the game. You do not want to send bored bank staring veterans to fight casual/new players.

    Alternatively, limit NPC capital billboards to a maximum gear tier of 2, which would give players who arrive at the village normally or from yellow zone holdings billboards a gear advantage over bored veterans.

    As for blue zone villages, I'd propose moving those villages into a yellow zone, to avoid various flagging complications or the need to come up with special rules for this particular edge case. Plenty of space in the game world to relocate a village to, or hell, at worst, make them 'non-capturable villages' akin to those rare wilderness houses.
     
    #49 Raap, Jan 12, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
  10. rikilii

    rikilii Celestial

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    I like it, except that you could also include items in the reward package if they are the kind that are generally dealt with in large numbers (like enchanting mats). For instance, it wouldn't be terribly disproportionate to include 25 Q4 bile in a reward. Each member in a party of 5 would get enough for the bile component of one keen, and it would be pretty easy to divide up because of the larger quantity. Also, if you adjust the crafting recipes for something like dyes, to require, say, 10 pigments, and also increase the drop rates on pigments to correspond, you could then include, say, 20-100 pigments in each village drop to divide more or less evenly among the winning party.
     
  11. Ibis

    Ibis Dire Zombie
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    Keep it on topic
     
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  12. MerleisAirdburne

    MerleisAirdburne Black Knight
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    Do villages feel like a worthwhile opportunity for profit in their current state?

    No.

    I have seen many pvpers eager to sell keys and maps, which leads me to believe that many players would prefer pure gold instead of having to sell their rewards. This allows pvpers to earn gold by pvping, and use it to purchase needed goods from crafters. Thoughts?

    Keys and Maps are not giving things people want(portal shard, runestones which can be purchased from vendors. They dont give dyes either). Also, the villages dont give dyes.

    Do you think announcements of how many players captured a village should be removed? On one hand, this can warn you of a potential zerg, on the other hand, it can discourage you from contesting the village and due to the presence of alts, the zerg may not actually be a zerg at all.

    No.

    How do you feel about making villages have a single, fixed reward (e.g Alhali is worth 50k), sent to the party leader, or arriving in some other way? The advantage of this is the ability to control loot output, which creates a more level playing field overall. Zerging remains an option, but the reward would be smaller. Conversely, a single risk-taker can attempt to take the full loot reward. This also fixes alt abuse.

    Fixed rewards are boring, once people do a certain village enough they wont want to go back.

    How big of a role do you feel your gear score should play?

    Gear score is mostly a joke since people can just use a house bank to get Tier 6. Also, you can have party members go and cap everything, then once the village's score is close to 600 the other people in the party port over with Tier 6 gear. Also, you can just bring an Infernal Chest piece and 2 other Infernal fillers and be Tier 6, its not that hard to game the system with little consequence.

    What is your opinion on porting to villages from billboards? Should it be embraced completely, removed, or tweaked?

    If BPG wants a good system to drive PvP by porting people to a location for action, Arena would make more sense at this point.


    PS. Please dont delete my post just because you dont agree with my opinions. This is honest feedback and isn't against TOS.
     
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  13. NonFactor

    NonFactor Forest Golem
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    There should pretty much always be a village people can go to to fight over.
     
  14. TyteDaddyTite

    TyteDaddyTite Obsidian Golem
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    Nice guys, let's do village loot for the 10th time.
     
  15. Tolbin

    Tolbin Goblin Scout
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    Happy to see so many constructive replies. VCP's are part of a larger discussion about how to make the game more attractive to a larger audience. In this regard, I support the notion that VCP's should vary in their rewards, based on their location, so that players of different levels can decide where they will compete. A cap on overall reward seems suitable.

    This is in the context of a desperate need to introduce holding upkeep costs, at a level where larger zergs really have to think about whether they really need that holding with a farm and a quarry, or whether they want to focus on the holding with a Leen/Neithal mine. Lots of small clans would be happy to have a less desirable holding just to live out of. BPG, grasp the nettle and introduce such costs! It will help the game.
     
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  16. Scrubby Bear

    Scrubby Bear Eodrin
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    I would bet that the rewards are not the problem and never really have been.
    The issue with villages is that your chances of getting a good or even interesting fight are always very low. Villages in the history of the game have always escalated to a point where you can only show up if your a top 5% player that can also run very well or your confident that your in a zerg or some combination of the aforementioned things.

    The focus on villages shouldn't be making them have even greater or better rewards. It should be on mechanics that generate better fights. One of the biggest and most crippling issues the game has is the time investment required before you can have fun. Going to villages and getting your brains blown out by elite players or getting ruthlessly zerged down aren't fun. It gets really old going to village after village hoping for a fun fight only to easily win or brutally lose every time. Ideally every village you go to should be as close to 50% as possible for anyone that shows up to win. Also aside from being super boring, it completely fucks the economy up when the same people are winning every single time.

    For this to work the game needs some kind of ranking system. It doesn't have to be perfect, just a simple win/lose. It can simply add up rankings to generate numerically uneven but ranking equal fights like a 5v4 with the 4 having slightly higher ranked players. It should also utilize every village to keep as many going at once. The goal isn't to create perfect fights just to make ones closer matched than raw open world ass beatings that get old super fast and make people quit.
     
  17. rikilii

    rikilii Celestial

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    This seems a lot like certain elite players reaping what they sow. Many of them have demanded that every aspect of combat be purely skill-based, and bitched about any feature that devs have tried to add to dull the edge of that even slightly, so that less skilled players (or just those who don't have 5 hours a day to duel) can play a bigger role. The end result is a game that a couple hundred people really want to play.
     
    #57 rikilii, Jan 14, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
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  18. Scrubby Bear

    Scrubby Bear Eodrin
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    I would argue that having a super high skill ceiling isn't bad, but actually great for the game. It is a complete failure to in any way shape or form aim players at opponents suited to them in day to day play that is wrong and hurts the game. Its amazing that you can play this game for years and still be improving and I hope they never change that. I do however hope that they make it less and less worth it to crush lesser players (and clans), and more and more worth it for elite players to seek out fights against other elite players (and clans).
     
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  19. Chantree

    Chantree Dire Zombie
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    This, please and thanks.
     
  20. Volfen

    Volfen Celestial
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    Since trawlers are a thing with today's patch, make sea villages "danger zones" while active (increased loot). Off the top of my head:
    • Eltaria
    • Three Pirates
    • Hundvin
    • Namlit
    • Aziram
    • Baslan's Escape
    • Zanthia
    • Jamukar's Fall
    • Water Gem
    Have 1 sea village go live every other wave (ie once per hour).

    Alternatively (or in addition), if one or more boats are within VCP UI radius when the village is capped, have it send an extra bounty to a random one of them (regardless of being in the capturing group) directly to the ship strongbox (If there is no ship with a strongbox, no one gets it).