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We need a new siege system

Discussion in 'Game Design Discussion' started by Franchise, Jan 21, 2017.

  1. Franchise

    Franchise Fire Elemental
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    The siege system... It was meant for large scale pvp, but failed in so many ways. First of all the major performance issue when anything near "large scale" happens. This causes for an unenjoyable experience for many of the players in the siege. Mouse drag, freezing up, and crashing of client from the memory leak darkfall creates are just some of the negatives from large scale sieges. Then when you finally do have a 40 vs 40. The "Attackers".. you know, the one's who sieged the city to fight the defenders, the one's who have to wait for 22 hours after sieging.. now have to not attack but "defend" their siege stone for 1 hour before they can go back to "attacking" like the reason they sieged for.

    It's also too expensive and too time consuming with a major lack of consistent enjoyment. Clans literally have to prep for hours before a siege. Who has time to do that everyday for maybe 1 hour of fun.

    If you access the time vs reward for the current siege system it loses by a landslide

    So let me suggest this

    Fast and Easy
    You place a siege, it gives you a 22 hour preparation timer. And a 5v5 is placed for the holding. No 1 hour wait, no lag, no poor performance. The siege is cheap and fast and a guaranteed fight for 5 of your clan members.

    Balance is the deciding factor
    Any five players that participate in one siege are placed on a 24 hour cool-down and cannot participate in another siege until those 24 hours are up. This requires clans to be more well rounded then just having a few good players by forcing large clans to have many 5v5 teams in order to defend multiple holdings

    Fun for everyone
    This would be beneficial throughout the ranks of all clans and even the lesser skilled players would have opportunities to fight other clans who has members that are of equal skill on a consistent basis for holdings.

    Open world interaction
    This siege system would give value in each individuals own performance rather than just being part of a zerg. This would encourage each player to go out and farm and make gear bags so they can participate in the sieges they may take part in.

    Content content content:Acitivity activity activity:New Player Experience
    This would allow for dozens of sieges a day, a less time consuming but very fun approach to darkfall, a reason to log in and farm and a major outlet for new players to truly enjoy the game by fighting their own skill levels for something that matters.

    Hamlet's 5v5
    Cities with no wonder - 20v20
    Cities with wonder - 50v50


    With this you could propose the lowering of durability of items so the demand of consistently getting gear would be needed but that's for another argument. (consider the thought of increasing drop rates and lowering durability of items)
     
    #1 Franchise, Jan 21, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2017
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  2. Aristos Giannes

    Aristos Giannes Cairn Giant
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    I really don't want the game to be turned into "Prearranged-fight-fall". Instead they should do what they can to optimize the game so it can handle the large battles better. With modern technology it's absolutely possible for your average rig to handle sieges well, I think the fault lies in the game itself. Massive scale battles is one of the biggest selling factors of the game. When I show friends the game, they get the most excited seeing tons of people show up in the same spot for sieges.
     
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  3. Franchise

    Franchise Fire Elemental
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    Sieges already exist, they are a form of pre-arranged fights. This is a much better idea than the current one.. more time efficient, easier, better for new players and holds a better balance for all skill ranges.
     
  4. Aristos Giannes

    Aristos Giannes Cairn Giant
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    I should say 'pre arranged wager duels'. I agree sieges do need to be changed, but I don't want them turned into death matches. They need to stay as a fight over a resource, so it can end up creating multiple fights of different scales that reward various tactics based on the location.
     
  5. Franchise

    Franchise Fire Elemental
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    You don't think an arena style 5v5 for a holding would not have follow up fights outside of the arena in a world that has no protection zones other than new player cities? There absolutely would be. You don't think fighting of a holding is a resource? You don't think fighting over a holding near a spawn that has something you need is not fighting over a resource that is for another resource? Not everyone want's to be zerged or be the one zerging. Sometimes players want equal skilled equal number fights for something that matters. What this game needs so it doesn't fail is a better new player experience and tons of content or a single implementation of content that is consistent (this one) that is easy to implement for the coders who have very little experience with this game who only have 4 months or so before they plan to "launch the game"
     
  6. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    Let's start with removing the requirement to take down walls and add in siege windows where server up sieges are still possible but your stone is half hp and the clan stone is 2x hp if sieged outside of a 12 hour window. 5v5's are not sieges. Performance in large scale sucks bad because of 2 reasons. New textures and new york server.

    Also people could just have better players log into the bad players accounts. Your group is well known for this.

    I'm down for arena style stuff but sieges shouldn't be part of it.
     
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  7. Franchise

    Franchise Fire Elemental
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    Can you ever hold a realistic debate or have a proper input without being dramatic? You're talking about Arrow and only arrow. Cool your jets.

    I've never cared about politics or holdings and have always only suggested what would be better for newer players. So try and do the same and see how this could be enjoyable for new players or players that aren't nearly good as us. It gives them a purpose, a reason to get better.

    You are right.. players could log into others accounts. But I would think that would probably be more so against the top players and clans becasue of ego's... I would bitch smack one of my guys if they tried to log on a noobs account just to stomp some noobs. I would hope most other clans would do the same.

    If they want content this is an effective idea, I read almost everyone's suggestions with a non-biased intention and if player's want something new and easy this is something that should at least be dissected and formed into something. I agree large scale is fun, The idea of it could be rankings of cities vs how many players?

    hamlets - 5v5
    non wonder cities 20 vs 20
    wonder cities - 50 vs 50 ( or as many slots as each team can fill )

    This isn't a completely thought out idea the numbers vs city importance is an idea I just got from your feed back. A positive outlook and approach from the community is what get's things rolling. If we ever want a change we need to stop nitpicking things but more so do a vote on definite ideas that they should put into action. Or at least promote the ideas.
     
  8. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    Long as i'm at it, allying a clan should cost 25k gold (number is up for debate) each way. That would help to prevent temporary nutcups for every siege and make more permanent alliances a choice that you want to consider and not just press ally.
    --- Post updated ---
    juicy has a history of the same thing, so does down here. I help new players whether they are in my clan or not. I don't spend ALL my time doing it but occasionally I will spend time with players and teach them first about mouse sensitivity, resolution, dpi, and other things that have a baseline impact. Then I tell them about transitions, stat cycles, use of terrain and parrying, etc. I tell them how ping works with hitboxes as well. Just spent an hour last night teaching some guy in justice about all of that.
     
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  9. Franchise

    Franchise Fire Elemental
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    Down Here doesn't have a mage account so he played a mage account. There's 2 differences. Can you get your head out of the gutter please.. This isnt us vs them, or me vs you.. This is the game and what ideas are good.
     
  10. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    It was a valid concern and a problem with your 5v5 idea. I do agree the current siege system blows and the amount of work invested rarely is equal to the amount of fun recieved.
     
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  11. Scrubby Bear

    Scrubby Bear Eodrin
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    I don't want sieges to ever be an arena thing. Unless the players themselves arrange the 'X vs X' fight for the holding. Part of the sandbox is being able to fuck with other people and pay the consequences for it. Its what drives a lot of the conflict and rivalries in the game and provides a lot of fun for people that might not be in clans capable of winning sieges or in clans that do not want more holdings.

    I do wish we had siege windows. I feel like the lack of them is the only thing holding us back from getting shard holder style sieges back. If we got siege windows, then we could have snap/shard holder sieges again that provide instant fun. No more 24 hours to cup ahead of time, or plan your 75 vet siege force to roach someone else's fight. Would make the sieges a bit smaller and roach resistant which are good. It would also make city raids more 'threatening' again, which would be another good thing. Would also make multi-sieging more effective which should make it harder for alliances to get insane amounts of holdings.
     
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  12. Franchise

    Franchise Fire Elemental
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    I think regardless, no change is the wrong outcome here. changes need to be made and there needs to be real testing. How can we know if this is a bad idea if it's never tried? I've been part of a dozen beta's of other games and over the course of beta there are dozen's of big changes that sometimes are even reverted because they end up not being as good as they looked on paper. Most people I know enjoy even number fights, and guaranteed fights. Literally the only reason half the siege force you guys have been fighting is even logging in is because it's a guaranteed fight. I had to re download darkfall, that's how done I was with inconsistent pvp or 1 siege a week.
     
  13. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    why the fuck would you randomly come to this thread to talk about that?
    --- Post updated ---
    Funny, half the reason we are so ineffective right now is because the server no showed for a couple weeks to our sieges and people stopped wanting to log in.
     
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  14. Dion

    Dion Goblin Warrior

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    I welcome the liberal tears let them flow i thrive off the negative energy you portray
     
  15. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    wierdo
     
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  16. Dion

    Dion Goblin Warrior

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    fengor just got raped by an Aussie with 250+ ping gg bud just give up already I cant wait to take all of your holdings
     
  17. Grimtide

    Grimtide Evil Eye
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    it's funny how you guys brag about other players achievements. juicy does the same thing.

    Do you see me bragging about rex or gotja killing any of your players? No because that's pathetic.

    Typical trumptard.
     
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  18. Juicy

    Juicy Black Knight
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    I didnt brag lol, they just watch some pre arranged fights thats it lol
    and why would you brag and put down people in your clan? like what
    Im sure if you could beat flash in a wager or anyone decent you would brag, fact is you cant even beat a aussie, poor little fella
     
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  19. Franchise

    Franchise Fire Elemental
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    @Andrew

    It's simple, the game needs changes. and the company needs investors


    implement this siege system

    reduce vcps to only the top 10 villages

    increase item drop rate and decrease overall durability of created items

    increase skill and stat gains at launch, and give 10x skill/stat gains during beta

    delay launch deadline to December 6th 2017 (christmas break for most teens)

    make these changes and I will invest 30k into your game and company.

    If you wanna talk more changes we can talk more money.
     
  20. Scrubby Bear

    Scrubby Bear Eodrin
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    Shit now hes going to know I was on his account again....
     
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