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Why I am not supporting Rise of Agon

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by skreww L00se, Nov 1, 2015.

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  1. skreww L00se

    skreww L00se Undead Dwarf
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    I will try to keep this as short and concise as possible but bear with me. I think that the foundation of the team behind it will lead to its demise. Ill state my points and then elaborate on them. Screenshots at the bottom.

    Kimoshou is more interested in creating a game development company than he is in creating a successful iteration of Darkfall.

    Kimoshou overrides the design team.

    Kimoshou is playing it like a politician. He won’t announce any drastic changes until after the initial purchases of the game.

    I will conceded that I have not been to every meeting but I have seen and heard enough to form my opinions. Kimoshou (Andrew) seems to be more interested in turning this into his job. They’ve had discussions about the game they would have to make after Darkfall because the engine won’t be able to support their changes. Every meeting is about advertising/marketing/logo design. We literally sat there and speculated on what subliminal meanings each logo would have on the customer. Bring forth the “Rise of Agon” brand and try to kind of hide the Darkfall name. In my opinion there are better things to talk about with the entire team.

    Kasmos, myself, Zanuul had some longer discussions coming to compromised agreements on changes. We looked at ideas proposed by each one of us, dissected their objective and worked backwards to find better ways to accommodate all play styles and types of customers. We were all in agreeance that fizzles should be removed from the game. However, Kimoshou would barely listen to us when we tried to converse with him and he made the argument that he wanted fizzles in the game if you were above 0 encumbrance. It would affect too many other things like tongue rot and he didn’t want to remove “features” from the game.

    They need your seed money. The road map he’s posted are all non-controversial changes and there is a reason they are vague. They want the initial money from the existing community to spring board their project. Later, he will impose his silly ideas. I asked to have a meeting with him about these subjects but he declined. Why do you even need a design team if you won’t listen to them? Instead of spending money on advertising, branding and marketing why don’t you tell the community what changes you would like to make to the game barring any technical difficulties, as New Dawn has done?

    Dest and I had been arguing prior but I do not have screenshots of it. I was at the point where it was like talking to a brick wall with him.




    To the community: I gave it an honest effort but as most of you feared, Kimoshou is not the person to lead such a project. Rest in peace Darkfall.

    skreww L00se; Zealot; Black Shields.
     
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  2. negocromn

    negocromn Black Knight
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    Welp, this sucks.
     
  3. Kilset

    Kilset Black Knight
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    [​IMG]
     
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  4. Synna

    Synna Black Knight
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    hm
     
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  5. Andrew

    Andrew Obsidian Golem
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    Wow you must have been sitting on slack when I removed you from the design group Skreww, this post came 14 min after you were removed. This is pretty childish but if you want to really put things all of a sudden out here publicly that's your choice, thanks anyways for your time to help the project too bad it has to end like this. We have rarely spoken, you have barely been involved in this project except for the odd time you pop in. Design discussion isn't something that takes a few minutes and we all agree on things it takes time to refine ideas, you have good ideas but there's debate involved which you didn't seem interested in doing which was why I removed you, it's necessary.

    Most of the things you are stating are obviously not true and I've been very transparent from the start of this project, moreso than many on the team would be happy about lol because I don't like keeping things behind closed doors typically. Unfortunately with a large group not everyone sees eye to eye, you are entitled to your opinion but please don't post screen shots from internal discussions that's just not classy.

    See you around!

    Edit: LOL that's awesome Kilset, loved TNG :D
     
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  6. Owyn Magnus

    Owyn Magnus Varangian Warthane

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    Holy shit Skreww, I am not involved with this project but that is the most asinine post I have ever seen.


    Get WAY over yourself. You came off as an arrogant asshole, which may not be far off from who you really are.

    This drama was not necessary. Basically it was "they are doing things I don't like, so I will try to sabotage the whole thing and take the ball (which isn't even mine) and go home.

    Grow the fuck up.

    Edit: And what the fuck? We all assume they are doing this to try to do it as their job. What the fuck are you thinking they are doing this for?

    Good for them, i hope they take Darkfall and make it better. I hope they use what success they get to create new games.

    Thats the fucking POINT.
     
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  7. Aristos Giannes

    Aristos Giannes Cairn Giant
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    Well i'll happily fill in as a PvP and game design consultant if necessary. I can't get enough of debating :p
     
  8. Zoro

    Zoro Spellgazer

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    Skrew's suggestions aren't getting into the game? There is a god, and I thank him. Good work getting rid of this one boys.
     
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  9. GrimReapiN

    GrimReapiN Chosen of Khamset
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    This thread will be kept open.


    There are two sides to every story. If anyone has questions, ask in the Q&A thread.

    Keep it civil please. :)
     
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  10. Scrapnotcrap

    Scrapnotcrap Eodrin
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    ''Kimoshou is playing it like a politician. He won’t announce any drastic changes until after the initial purchases of the game.''

    Is this the reason we don't get much infos? I must agree, we got nothing more than the road-map ATM. We want more so we can discuss what would be good or not.

    In the DnD forum, there's a lot of things we disagree with, but we come into terms eventually. We'd like to do the same here. We need more info's and for idea's that we don't like, we wish to discuss on them just to come into terms as a community.

    I thought we were all supposed to be involved when it comes to taking final decisions on pretty much everything.
     
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  11. Zeb

    Zeb Infernal
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    doesn't show up to meetings, expects all his ideas to be recognized and accepted.....doesn't get his way...quits.
     
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  12. Clarence Swamptown

    Clarence Swamptown Black Knight
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    Let's just say that I am not surprised.
     
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  13. Ogrinn

    Ogrinn Deadeye
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    So they are trying to create a company that will run a profiting thriving game. They don't want to make major changes on a whim because they know that if they do they can kill their game. Makes sense.

    @Kimoshou Is your reasoning for being against taking out fizzles because you think people would run around as a mage in the heaviest armour?
     
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  14. RootedOak

    RootedOak Oak Lord
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  15. helgrik

    helgrik Infernal
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    and after all this he will still buy the game... play it... and love it
     
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  16. Fnights

    Fnights Earth Elemental

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    He has a point however and i know what he mean, this toxic community can be the complete failure of this project.

    As i said numerous times, Darkfall shouldn't rely on a niche playerbase of old nostalgic vets that QQ and cry because they want heir toy back, Darkfall need to evolve, change and turn page. The more the game will stay the same the more this project can fail.
    Darkfall 1 failed, failed because the implementation was incomplete and bad designed, the accident all the vets speaking about was something fascinating but not enought to retain population.

    I still think that the more the game change regarding the meta the more can be succesfull as a commercial product, time changes, mmorpg player changes, since UO a lot, otherwise Darkfall will still and remain a niche game for some basement dwellers.
     
  17. Aristos Giannes

    Aristos Giannes Cairn Giant
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    As it's been said many, many times before, you should consider how many players left in the beginning after an abysmal launch due to

    - an painfully insane grind, made more painful by feeling the need to compete against clans who reached max magic via exploits

    - magic itself being incredibly overpowerful with splash damage doing 90 by merely aiming behind someone

    - rampant hacking

    - players who bought the game not able to play it for weeks

    - promised features not implemented, and no word from AV if they were scratched or not, and if they were why. Literally no comment from them at all.

    And yet with all of that, the population that stuck through it stayed with the game for some reason. There was clearly something the game had right to keep a low population passionate enough about the game to bring it back. For the majority of the players, it was the meta of combat. Yes, the game needs to be changed in many ways to be successful. But at least recognize that the meta is what kept the game alive after a miserable first year. Drastic changes to the meta could kill that 'magic' that kept players playing.
     
  18. Fnights

    Fnights Earth Elemental

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    You are right about the grind, but the grind was the consequence of the bad implementation of the meta combat system, an incomplete system, and the missing features promised that should have been usefull to change progression and make every playstyle different (skill cap, prestige classes).
    instead, since they didn't have time, they opt in for the easy way everyone learn everything, causing bloodwalls, huge gap between casuals and hardcore, overpowered characters. A complete failure.
    Hacking not banned, devs that don't care was just the last nail in the coffin.

    I know that some people stayed, i played the game myself till the end after all, i played it because i liked the engine, the physic, the large world, the pve, the massive sieges, but apart this the game was a crap and i can't blame people who leaved (my guild included) and the bad advertisement and review from the mmoRPG community and game websites. They were right.

    But i disagree on your last sentence, is the meta the issue, the skill system not how it work but how was designed, this is the part that imo, should be changed and rewamped completely, an accidental incomplete system that only a few niche of players really liked.
    The only reason i continued to play till the very end was because they introduced the destro spec and give me an alternative to the jack of all trades, and because of Celiah.
     
  19. onslaught

    onslaught Black Knight
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    You look like a fucking pussy. Good post.
     
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  20. propain

    propain Black Knight
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    This post screamed of childish behavior haha by the OP. Glad nobody is taking this cry bait. I don't know internally if he is right or wrong about andrew not listening to his design team one bit, but everything else complained about seemed pretty good...I want DFO to be like this teams job, I want them to take it serious, consider all playstyles, and advertise to a wider audience that isn't just l33tpvp#420...that crowd will still join because they need darkfall. (As long as combat stays the same that is).
     
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